PannySVHS Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 4 hours ago, bwhitz said: Very nice! Did you turn down all the NR and Sharpening in camera? Hallo, no honour to me in that regard. It´s from the testers from slashcam. They turned sharpness and NR down afik from other tests of the GH line since the GH2. bwhitz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IshootbeforeItalk Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 The achilles heel of the GH5 is Dynamic range imo. So when choosing between HLG and V-log I prefer more DR, thus V-log. Also as a film maker I want as much flexibility in post as possible to create a look. HLG was not designed for that. It's much more of a baked in look and if you prefer that look for your project, sure, choose it. But for creative freedom I prefer V-log much more. HLG is valuable for actual rec2020 delivery, or a work around if you don't have, or want to purchase V-log imo. markr041 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmspa Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Do you guys think that Panasonic will release Full VLog for the GH5S in the future? I heard that it allows 14 stops of dynamic range Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 7, 2018 Author Share Posted February 7, 2018 2 hours ago, IshootbeforeItalk said: The achilles heel of the GH5 is Dynamic range imo. So when choosing between HLG and V-log I prefer more DR, thus V-log. Also as a film maker I want as much flexibility in post as possible to create a look. HLG was not designed for that. It's much more of a baked in look and if you prefer that look for your project, sure, choose it. But for creative freedom I prefer V-log much more. HLG is valuable for actual rec2020 delivery, or a work around if you don't have, or want to purchase V-log imo. I think HLG has greater usable DR than VLog-L, but it is less flat. So if DR is your goal, and light grading will suffice, HLG might be your best option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seku Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 From what i remember from the Leeming Lut creator and @Sage, both state that dynamic range in Vlog-L mode and HLG is roughly similar. The difference is that V-log-L is made to intercut with Vlog from the EVA, and uses a rather shallow portion of the available bit range, whereas the HLG gets a more full-swing approach to the available range. Theoretically speaking, there should be more tonal definition in HLG. My main question is tho : how to expose HLG? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 7, 2018 Share Posted February 7, 2018 Tonal transitions are smoother, there’s less noise in the shadows and highlight roll off is nicer when shooting HLG for rec709. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 Well the UPS man just dropped off the GH5s, and I can tell you from my first experience with HLG on the GH5s, if you favor the shadows and blow out the highlights there are gobs of data to recover those highlights with. Rinad Amir, webrunner5 and jonpais 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 First test with HLG on the the GH5s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 Pretty freakin’ nuts Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin Hilton Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 16 hours ago, filmspa said: Do you guys think that Panasonic will release Full VLog for the GH5S in the future? I heard that it allows 14 stops of dynamic range According to my understanding, Panasonic created VLog L to better work with the GH4/GH5's native 12 stops of dynamic range possible from the sensors. Full VLog is created for the 14 stops of dynamic range possible from their Varicam line. So, adding full VLog to the Lumix cameras would not give a better dynamic range as the sensors cannot capture more than 12 stops. filmspa and markr041 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 It’s still important to keep in mind, there are at least a half-dozen other factors to consider aside from dynamic range when deciding whether or not V-Log is right for your project - noise levels, highlight roll off, tonal transitions, whether you’re trying to match with footage from other Panasonic cameras, how much grading you expect to be doing, whether or not you plan to deliver in HDR10 at some point in the future... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 6 hours ago, jonpais said: It’s still important to keep in mind, there are at least a half-dozen other factors to consider aside from dynamic range when deciding whether or not V-Log is right for your project - noise levels, highlight roll off, tonal transitions, whether you’re trying to match with footage from other Panasonic cameras, how much grading you expect to be doing, whether or not you plan to deliver in HDR10 at some point in the future... I plan to test VLog-L also, but I’m starting to feel like under most circumstances HLG might be the better choice. And since FCPX’s newest update makes HDR content easy to deal with I believe the reasons to favor it over VLog-L are justified. The problem with VLog-L on the GH5 and ‘S’ is that they are abbreviated versions, not full VLog. So crazy highlight recovery like what I posted is likely not possible with VLog-L. I have to admit, when I shot that footage and bought it into post I thought nothing short of raw could recover those blown out whites. I really didn’t think the data was there. But apparently HLG is pretty data rich. So the take away is protect the shadows, the highlights have a pretty good chance at being bought back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attila Bakos Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 37 minutes ago, DBounce said: I have to admit, when I shot that footage and bought it into post I thought nothing short of raw could recover those blown out whites. I really didn’t think the data was there. But apparently HLG is pretty data rich. Just asking, is there a chance that you interpreted HLG as video range in your NLE? My understanding is that it's full range, and it might look clipped when interpreted as video range, even though it is not. deezid and Georgios 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmspa Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 8 hours ago, Benjamin Hilton said: According to my understanding, Panasonic created VLog L to better work with the GH4/GH5's native 12 stops of dynamic range possible from the sensors. Full VLog is created for the 14 stops of dynamic range possible from their Varicam line. So, adding full VLog to the Lumix cameras would not give a better dynamic range as the sensors cannot capture more than 12 stops. Thanks! I didn't know about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deezid Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 1 minute ago, Attila Bakos said: Just asking, is there a chance that you interpreted HLG as video range in your NLE? My understanding is that it's full range, and it might look clipped when interpreted as video range, even though it is not. That's exactly what it is. Open the files in Resolve and you'll see the full range without adjusting anything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 2 minutes ago, Attila Bakos said: Just asking, is there a chance that you interpreted HLG as video range in your NLE? My understanding is that it's full range, and it might look clipped when interpreted as video range, even though it is not. That's what it looked like in camera also... and on the SmallHD Focus monitor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deezid Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 8 minutes ago, DBounce said: That's what it looked like in camera also... and on the SmallHD Focus monitor. There"s a view assist for HLG which helps exposing to the right using histogram. You can expose to the exact clipping point in HLG mode and Davinci Resolve (only Davinci Resolve atm) will show it correctly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 back to the drawing board Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DBounce Posted February 8, 2018 Author Share Posted February 8, 2018 22 minutes ago, deezid said: There"s a view assist for HLG which helps exposing to the right using histogram. You can expose to the exact clipping point in HLG mode and Davinci Resolve (only Davinci Resolve atm) will show it correctly. Reading over Mystery Boxes writeup about shooting HDR on the GH5/s it seems they make a strong case for the Atomos products. They have built in HDR monitors and a recorder for less than the price of the smallest SmallHD HDR monitor. I need to do some back to back shooting comparing this to the GH5 (a great camera in it's own right). I think the edge as a video camera, will have to go to the GH5s. Slightly more cinematic (if that is still a thing). And definitely better in low-light, but that topic has been covered sufficiently. As a general purpose camera the GH5 remains a top pick. The two cameras sort of compliment each other. I say sort of because the color science is different on the 'S'... I think it might lean more towards the EVA1 than the GH5. Which is... ? Well lets just say it's not optimal if you currently have GH5 also. I would hope that Panasonic can address this in firmware. Both cameras should match. The HLG assist I did not really know about, or more to the point was more likely something I heard about and glossed over. It's possible I made a mistake. There definitely a learning curve to shooting HDR, but I am thinking it is something we are all going to need to master in the near term. Most flagship smartphones can display HDR. As can most Mid to high-end TVs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 8, 2018 Share Posted February 8, 2018 What computer do you edit on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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