JurijTurnsek Posted August 16, 2017 Share Posted August 16, 2017 14 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: Looks really nice. Very detailed indeed. Btw, read the article, and I know we are talking "real" cameras here. But the Nokia 1520 actually got 4K video added in firmware Hehe, well that iteration of Nokia went down the shitter quick (probably due to the OS, but still). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MdB Posted August 28, 2017 Share Posted August 28, 2017 "You know what? Here’s a crazy suggestion… I would love to shoot video through an optical viewfinder. Motion picture film cameras have optical viewfinders. This would be possible on the X Pro 2 with the hybrid viewfinder assists for frame-lines and focus active during video recording, instead of the main live-view display." This is why I was deeply saddened that Leica didn't include the SL's video capabilities in the M10. Being able to compose using the rangefinder optical VF and being able to pull focus perfectly with the rangefinder would have made it entirely unique in the world of video. Even if they just had a clean HDMI out through an optional grip or something and only turns the 'video' menu on when attached to keep the stills oriented folks happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted August 28, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted August 28, 2017 The Leica M that was released a few years ago shoots video (HD 4:2:2) and has a rangefinder. So no need to wait. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 28, 2017 Administrators Share Posted August 28, 2017 Leica removed video from the M10 due to photographers complaining. Old men huh!? maxotics and karin 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted August 28, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted August 28, 2017 I can somewhat get it. On some cameras I kinda wished they would have just skipped video and reduced cost, give another button function or reduced size. The Leica Q for example and maybe even the X70. Personally I would f..ing love to buy an M10. But its simply way over my budget. And Im perfectly happy with it not having video. My dream camera however would be an MD based on the M10 body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil A Posted August 28, 2017 Share Posted August 28, 2017 The question is though how much you can save on cost and/or size by omitting video if you still have to implement live view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted August 28, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted August 28, 2017 2 hours ago, Phil A said: The question is though how much you can save on cost and/or size by omitting video if you still have to implement live view. They can skip that two if they want to Its more of a principle thing. I like that some of my cameras dont have video, would never use it anyway. Its like in here where most just use their camera for video but have paid ALOT for the still image functions. I know I have many times in the past. Seems like a waste. But I guess its how it is with many things. Ive not shot a single frame of 4K with the XT20, but loads of HD. Ive never used its audio input. Ive never made use of its jpeg functions. Etc. We always have to pay a little extra for stuff we might not need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 28, 2017 Administrators Share Posted August 28, 2017 It's more of a marketing thing than a principle... The purity of the camera as an artistic photography tool is tainted when you put modern stuff like video and wifi on it. And the association most 'purist / traditional' photographers make with video is that video is something you do with an iphone, point and shoot, or something you do with a film crew at an extremely high level that has nothing to do with being a lone photographer / artist... So they don't feel it has a place on a traditional photographic tool like the Leica M, and I totally understand that, right tool for the job, etc. However for me it's nice to have on even the most photography focused body... Even if you'd be crazy to pick an M for video over a SL or GH5... It is the convergence of stills and video that is the future for me, more than the segmentation of tools into pro stills cameras and pro video cameras. maxotics and karin 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Sewell Posted August 28, 2017 Share Posted August 28, 2017 I tend to think that whether you're doing stills or video the very best option is to have a machine that is 100% optimised for that task - because it's really only then that the camera gets out of the way - where you're not fighting it in one way or the other. Of course - that ain't the way the world is going so... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 28, 2017 Administrators Share Posted August 28, 2017 I don't find this to be the case. The GH5 does both stills and video while getting out the way. It's seamless, and far more convenient to use than a cinema camera. It has auto-exposure, a button to start recording, a very long run-time on one small battery and goes in the palm of your hand. Not so a highly specialised RED Epic which is heavy, requires a brick for a battery, has no point & shoot modes or full auto and needs specialised knowledge to use. karin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MdB Posted August 29, 2017 Share Posted August 29, 2017 17 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: The Leica M that was released a few years ago shoots video (HD 4:2:2) and has a rangefinder. So no need to wait. I already owned the M 240, the video was an interesting feature that was very overlooked, but ultimately was of poor quality (even at release). With the SL's video capabilities it could have been quite a serious tool if both a little extra though and a little extra marketing of the real benefits. Heck Leica even make M mount cine lenses. 15 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: I can somewhat get it. On some cameras I kinda wished they would have just skipped video and reduced cost, give another button function or reduced size. The Leica Q for example and maybe even the X70. Personally I would f..ing love to buy an M10. But its simply way over my budget. And Im perfectly happy with it not having video. My dream camera however would be an MD based on the M10 body. I had an M-D, loved it. An M10 based M-D would be amazing, or better yet a Monochrom M-D. 12 hours ago, Mattias Burling said: They can skip that two if they want to Its more of a principle thing. I like that some of my cameras dont have video, would never use it anyway. Its like in here where most just use their camera for video but have paid ALOT for the still image functions. I know I have many times in the past. Seems like a waste. But I guess its how it is with many things. Ive not shot a single frame of 4K with the XT20, but loads of HD. Ive never used its audio input. Ive never made use of its jpeg functions. Etc. We always have to pay a little extra for stuff we might not need. It is a misunderstanding that: more stuff = more $$$'s. The fact is in a mass production product it needs to appeal to the widest possible audience within it's already small niche, I mean high(er than a smartphone) end cameras are already a niche. Having 'less' doesn't mean it costs less, invariably it costs more, because less people would be willing to buy it. For example how many people will you alienate by not having a JPEG engine? Or having camera features that low cost smartphones have and are considered 'must haves' by the buying population? NOT having these things limits your audience, so the R&D and tooling and everything else that goes into manufacturing has to be spread over far less units. 12 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: It's more of a marketing thing than a principle... The purity of the camera as an artistic photography tool is tainted when you put modern stuff like video and wifi on it. And the association most 'purist / traditional' photographers make with video is that video is something you do with an iphone, point and shoot, or something you do with a film crew at an extremely high level that has nothing to do with being a lone photographer / artist... So they don't feel it has a place on a traditional photographic tool like the Leica M, and I totally understand that, right tool for the job, etc. However for me it's nice to have on even the most photography focused body... Even if you'd be crazy to pick an M for video over a SL or GH5... It is the convergence of stills and video that is the future for me, more than the segmentation of tools into pro stills cameras and pro video cameras. I understand the sentiment Andrew, which is why I think they could have implemented it but without it affecting users who only want a photographic tool. We already know that that camera has the sensor and processor capable of it in the SL, they just made no way to access it in the M10. However they could have done something like the Multifunction Grip from the M 240 (that added connectivity and GPS in that model) but a video centric one with a clean HDMI or mini SDI output, mic in / out (and heck a record button). When the grip is attached the menus appear for it's features, when there is no grip attached it is exactly as it is now. This way people can also say 'if you want the video features you can pay the extra for it, but I don't have to'. Most 'cine' cameras are just sensors and processors in boxes anyway, so this would be no different really. 6 hours ago, Tim Sewell said: I tend to think that whether you're doing stills or video the very best option is to have a machine that is 100% optimised for that task - because it's really only then that the camera gets out of the way - where you're not fighting it in one way or the other. Of course - that ain't the way the world is going so... Oh balderdash. The M10 in it's 'purist' form that 'gets out of the way' has fallen back to only having one metering mode, off the shutter curtains. Where the previous M 240 with all its video trickery (treachery?) had a very useful expansion of metering where it could meter right off the image sensor, even while not doing live view, that gave far more advanced and accurate metering in a variety of lighting. This came from the technology of live view which is basically a video feed off sensor that is not stored. Writing that video feed to a memory card only requires one button. On the converse, there are ZERO optical viewfinders that use usable on 'dedicated' video camera designs. There are zero rangefinders on the same. Rangefinders are extraordinarily useful as they do essentially the job of dual pixel or OSPD AF... But manually controlled, rather than computer controlled. So when you are moving that lens to attain focus, you aren't waiting for things to come into focus and hope you stopped and the most in focus point, you actually see how far you have to go until you achieve focus, whilst your view is clear for composition and seeing 'outside the frame'. So you can pull focus without overstepping and ramp your pull speed to come to a slow stop. Much like blocking and marks allow a focus puller to do, but without the time / planning requirement. There is not one 'dedicated' device that does that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted August 29, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted August 29, 2017 9 hours ago, Tim Sewell said: I tend to think that whether you're doing stills or video the very best option is to have a machine that is 100% optimised for that task - because it's really only then that the camera gets out of the way - where you're not fighting it in one way or the other. Of course - that ain't the way the world is going so... I tend to agree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted September 6, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted September 6, 2017 Rumor says the update is tomorrow. I'm for one am pretty excited. I don't feel the need for the 4K. The HD is just lovely imo. But Im hoping that there will be other stuff as well. Maybe we get histogram while recording or peaking while recording like on the X100f. At the same time Im scared that they will implement the same need to switch drive mode like on he X100f, X-T20 and X-T2. I hate that. So fingers crossed. Also Im hoping for the ability to put exposure lock on the front button. Might happen. And the ability to view the entire screen on the miniature LCD in the OVF in single focus. Probably wont happen. Latest rumor also says its getting tethering. But the one thing Im secretly hoping for the most is the announcement of the Fuji X80. Ive been patiently waiting for that or a Ricoh GRii. Both current models are just a tweak from being the last stealthy street camera I would ever need (yeah right.. ). If it has the new sensor it will be magic. It might get 4K as well.... ok not a video camera but still, I would find use for it. So one day to go! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted September 6, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted September 6, 2017 Pictures of the new X-E3 and the new lenses leaked. Think it has 4K, could be something to use as a travel hybrid or B-Cam. Maybe @mercer wants it Sadly no image of an X80, guess it wont happen. Still excited for the new Firmware. http://www.fujirumors.com/fujifilm-x-e3-xf80mm-macro-gf-45mm-images-price-yen-leaked/ mercer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted September 6, 2017 Administrators Share Posted September 6, 2017 So tomorrow is "Fujikina" aka party time and 4K firmware update for the Fuji X Pro 2!! If it doesn't happen, we are going to have to hang the DJ (FujiRumors) from a VERY high post. I have my hopes up like anything!! I see they are reporting in-body 5 axis stabilisation for the X-T2S as well... That would be a very nice move by Fuji. karin and jonpais 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted September 6, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted September 6, 2017 Fujirumors have always been on point in my experience. So I feel confident Im taking the apples from my garden to the juicer on Saturday. Feels like a perfect little family outing to test the new 4K. So my fingers are crossed that its announced and released tomorrow. Otherwise I will use it to test the X-T20 in 4K. BTW, here are a bunch of stills I took with the X-Pro2 and X-T20 side by side. I like that its not obvious which images are from the smaller and cheaper camera. Even the kitzoom blends well with the primes. There are 1-3 Leica Q images in there as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted September 7, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted September 7, 2017 It is official, sadly not until "late December". What makes me happy is the focus improvements. Because after ALOT of testing I had decided that the X-Pro2 AF was already enough for any sort of sports shooting needs I may encounter. And I have decided to get the 50-140/2.8 for such shooting. And then Fuji goes and makes it even better.. yey. Also the new roadmap with a 200mm f2.0 WR... yummy FUJIFILM X-Pro2: Ver.4.00 1. Addition of 4K video mode (excluding HDMI out) The update adds 4K video using the X Series’ famous Film Simulation modes. You can input audio from an external microphone. (Excluding HDMI output for recording) 2. Support for tether shooting via USB or Wi-Fi After connecting a camera to a computer, the compatible software (*1) will enable users to transfer images taken with the camera to the computer and save them in a specified folder, or to control the camera from the computer. 3. New AF tracking algorithm for moving subject Thanks to the newly developed image recognition algorithm, the update enhances AF-C to track moving subjects twice as fast as previous firmware(*2). In addition, the update also enhances tracking to be able to capture up to 50% smaller moving subjects than before. 4. Support “FUJIFILM X RAW STUDIO” Once connecting a camera to a computer via USB cable, the “FUJIFILM X RAW STUDIO” enables users to convert RAW files with X Processor Pro. The first batch processing will also be available. The “FUJIFILM X RAW STUDIO” can be downloaded from the FUJIFILM website for free. 5. Improve radio flash controller usability The upgrade allows users to shoot with compatible third party studio flash in high speed sync. or TTL mode via their radio controllers. 6. Support for backup/restore of camera settings via FUJIFILM X Acquire Once connecting a camera to a computer via USB cable, the “FUJIFILM X Acquire” allows users to backup/restore camera settings to/from a file. Copying all camera settings from one camera to another is available. They also added a function to the X-T20 that I really would have wanted last time I used it. FUJIFILM X-T20: Ver.1.10 1. Touch panel operation when using the EVF The firmware update will make it possible to use the touch panel while looking into the viewfinder. According to the operation method, it's possible to set the effective range of the touch panel to the full screen, right half, left half, or OFF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Sewell Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Quote 1. Support for backup/restore of camera settings via FUJIFILM X Acquire Once connecting a camera to a computer via USB cable, the “FUJIFILM X Acquire” allows users to backup/restore camera settings to/from a file. Copying all camera settings from one camera to another is available. For the X-T2 - funnily enough I was bemoaning (to myself) the lack of such an ability just yesterday as I laboriously copied all the settings from twin 1 to twin 2. Not as simple as doing it by SD card, as in other systems, but good enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted September 7, 2017 Share Posted September 7, 2017 Blown highlights, crushed blacks, oversharpened images - I'm afraid I'm not seeing anything here. For the very same hard earned money, $1,700, the GH5 is killing it. Skin tones aren't blowing me away either. The GH5 is a professional tool designed specifically for video, with input from filmmakers. The X-Pro2 is a stills camera with video features tacked on as an afterthought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members Mattias Burling Posted September 7, 2017 Author Super Members Share Posted September 7, 2017 1 hour ago, jonpais said: Blown highlights, crushed blacks, oversharpened images - I'm afraid I'm not seeing anything here. For the very same hard earned money, $1,700, the GH5 is killing it. Skin tones aren't blowing me away either. The GH5 is a professional tool designed specifically for video, with input from filmmakers. The X-Pro2 is a stills camera with video features tacked on as an afterthought. Where? (Because I know you don't mean the video I posted since it wasn't even shot with an X-Pro2. And it was obviously just some quick clips without an ND made for fun. I was planning on using my smartphone for it... and that would have been good enough. Hardly a reference for video quality imo. The stills in the video on the other hand look f..ing amazing, so you cant mean them. And Ive never been able to get anything as good looking from a Panasonic. If the GH5 is a video camera with still capabilities as an after thought.. well.. then why have they designed it as a stills camera.. what a waste.) j-oc 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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