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Andrew Reid

Panasonic GH5 - all is revealed!

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13 hours ago, Orangenz said:

Two things I noticed this weekend: Current timelapse photo count does not show on screen during capture. Exposure zebras disappear when exposure compensation is being changed. 

The zebras disappearing when exposure compensation is changed, is something I mentioned a while back with the G85, and is my biggest annoyance with the GH5. I can't begin to understand the rationale for this decision. You need to see the zebras while adjusting exposure, not reappearing after.

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1 hour ago, Ken Ross said:

The zebras disappearing when exposure compensation is changed, is something I mentioned a while back with the G85, and is my biggest annoyance with the GH5. I can't begin to understand the rationale for this decision. You need to see the zebras while adjusting exposure, not reappearing after.

So how do you use the Zebra feature...are Zebras not on if you turned them on?

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1 hour ago, Fritz Pierre said:

So how do you use the Zebra feature...are Zebras not on if you turned them on?

Fritz, they're on, but awkward to use. So let's say you're viewing your scene, and you see areas of overexposure as indicated by your zebras. You begin to adjust exposure down, but as soon as you press the exposure button, the zebras disappear! So rather than adjusting exposure down until your zebras disappear, you're really just guessing. If you adjust exposure down by 1/3EV and then exit the exposure adjustment, the zebras will either disappear if you adjusted down far enough, or reappear if you weren't aggressive enough in your adjustment. If the zebras are still there upon exiting exposure adjustment, you then need to hit the exposure adjustment again, and bang, the zebras again disappear as soon as you hit the exposure button. 

It works the same way on the G85. I can't begin to understand Panasonic's thinking on this.

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My half-baked "solution" to this is to adjust exposure using a variable ND filter.  It works nicely in terms of being able to finely adjust the histogram and accurately eliminate the zebras wherever you wish.   Clearly not a solution for all uses, however.

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3 hours ago, kinvermark said:

My half-baked "solution" to this is to adjust exposure using a variable ND filter.  It works nicely in terms of being able to finely adjust the histogram and accurately eliminate the zebras wherever you wish.   Clearly not a solution for all uses, however.

The strange this about this is if you are in A, S, or P modes and you adjust something else, like shutter speed, the same sort of rolling scale pops up but the zebras stay on screen. It's only with the exposure comp scale that the zebras disappear. Also, currently in P mode my dials don't do anything. It would be great to have one set to exposure comp just for P mode. Someone can learn me up on this please.

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9 hours ago, Orangenz said:

The strange this about this is if you are in A, S, or P modes and you adjust something else, like shutter speed, the same sort of rolling scale pops up but the zebras stay on screen. It's only with the exposure comp scale that the zebras disappear. Also, currently in P mode my dials don't do anything. It would be great to have one set to exposure comp just for P mode. Someone can learn me up on this please.

Well, it's the same when adjusting ISO manually. Pretty annoying indeed, as you have to go in and out of the menu to check for zebras.

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10 hours ago, Orangenz said:

The strange this about this is if you are in A, S, or P modes and you adjust something else, like shutter speed, the same sort of rolling scale pops up but the zebras stay on screen. It's only with the exposure comp scale that the zebras disappear. Also, currently in P mode my dials don't do anything. It would be great to have one set to exposure comp just for P mode. Someone can learn me up on this please.

Orangenz, that can't be assigned to one of the dials? I don't have the camera with me to try it, but I like the idea. 

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12 hours ago, Orangenz said:

The strange this about this is if you are in A, S, or P modes and you adjust something else, like shutter speed, the same sort of rolling scale pops up but the zebras stay on screen. It's only with the exposure comp scale that the zebras disappear. Also, currently in P mode my dials don't do anything. It would be great to have one set to exposure comp just for P mode. Someone can learn me up on this please.

Panasonic designs features but I think they never actually use their cameras to find issues or bad ergonomics. It is our job.

The EV comp button should work with P? It would be still nice and logical to use one of the wheels directly.

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18 hours ago, Ken Ross said:

Fritz, they're on, but awkward to use. So let's say you're viewing your scene, and you see areas of overexposure as indicated by your zebras. You begin to adjust exposure down, but as soon as you press the exposure button, the zebras disappear! So rather than adjusting exposure down until your zebras disappear, you're really just guessing. If you adjust exposure down by 1/3EV and then exit the exposure adjustment, the zebras will either disappear if you adjusted down far enough, or reappear if you weren't aggressive enough in your adjustment. If the zebras are still there upon exiting exposure adjustment, you then need to hit the exposure adjustment again, and bang, the zebras again disappear as soon as you hit the exposure button. 

It works the same way on the G85. I can't begin to understand Panasonic's thinking on this.

Not sure I understand. Which mode are you in? Automatic? Because I just took my G85 and pointed it at the computer and the zebras remained even after starting recording. I use the zebras every day and have never encountered a problem.

@Vesku As far as Panasonic never actually using their cameras to find issues or 'bad ergonomics', can you prove this statement, or is it just conjecture? Because the Panasonics I'm familiar with have outstanding ergonomics, save for the buttons that are too flush with the body.

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4 minutes ago, jonpais said:

 

@Vesku As far as Panasonic never actually using their cameras to find issues or 'bad ergonomics', can you prove this statement, or is it just conjecture? Because the Panasonics I'm familiar with have outstanding ergonomics, save for the buttons that are too flush with the body.

Panasonic actually has best ergonomics in general. There are still many half thought features which could be easily better if someone could think better.

-most Panasonic has no auto iso or EV comp in manual mode.

-GH3/GH4/GH5 has play/review button in wrong side. Very difficult to review image or video.

-almost useless EV comp button in GH3/GH4. Just decorative.

-not possible to change continuous autofocus on/off in other way than digging video menu deep.

-not possible to adjust image (contrast, saturation) in other way than digging menus. No FN option for that.

-not possible to use separate AF-lock and AE-lock even with custom buttons.

-no exposure info in video modes. I must guess my exposure values.

-GH4 EVF difficult to see whole image if not putting the eye very close to EVF lens. EVF lens damages very easily if touched.

-AF+MF feature works stupidly.

-I can find more but these are for start...

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3 hours ago, jonpais said:

Not sure I understand. Which mode are you in? Automatic? Because I just took my G85 and pointed it at the computer and the zebras remained even after starting recording. I use the zebras every day and have never encountered a problem.

 

Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment.

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4 hours ago, Ken Ross said:

Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment.

SOLVED

Quote

 

Joseph Linaschke‏ @photojoseph  25m25 minutes ago

More

Replying to @deepscience

I see. Push +/- button, zebras gone until pressing shutter. Solution; set back dial to do +/- and zebras stay. That's why I never noticed.

 

Custom settings/operation/Dial set/exposure Comp - set to lower dial

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4 hours ago, Ken Ross said:

Jon, in manual movie mode, whether I'm in P, A or S priority, as soon as I hit the exposure button (the +/- button), the zebras disappear. I'm not talking about seeing the zebras while recording, but rather while adjusting exposure prior to hitting the record button. I have the issue on the GH5 and have it on the G85. Orangenz has the same issue too. It just seems to be the way Panasonic implements zebras in these modes and it makes no sense. You want to see the zebras while you're adjusting exposure, not just after you've exited the adjustment.

Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear?

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1 minute ago, mercer said:

Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping?

hmmmm...

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On 19/04/2017 at 5:37 PM, Orangenz said:

Two things I noticed this weekend: Current timelapse photo count does not show on screen during capture. Exposure zebras disappear when exposure compensation is being changed. 

And I must have been blind. The photo count does show on the screen and in evf. Top right corner. Silly orange. Different place from GH4? I must have some excuse.

3 minutes ago, mercer said:

Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear?

you missed my post :O

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33 minutes ago, mercer said:

Sorry, maybe I am not understanding what you mean, but if you are in P, A or S modes, the zebras should disappear because the camera is making sure it isn't overexposing... so as soon as you hit exposure compensation, the camera is readjusting exposure so there is no clipping... so naturally the zebras would disappear?

No, not really. Let's say you go down in exposure less than is necessary to eliminate the zebras. So you're really still overexposed and you should still see the zebras. The problem is you won't as soon as you exit the adjustment.

50 minutes ago, Orangenz said:

SOLVED

Custom settings/operation/Dial set/exposure Comp - set to lower dial

YEAH!!!! YEAH!!!!! And did I say, YEAH!!!!

Orangenz, I'd give you 5 likes if I could. That was unquestionably my biggest annoyance with the cam and it's now gone. :):);)

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56 minutes ago, Ken Ross said:

No, not really. Let's say you go down in exposure less than is necessary to eliminate the zebras. So you're really still overexposed and you should still see the zebras. The problem is you won't as soon as you exit the adjustment.

YEAH!!!! YEAH!!!!! And did I say, YEAH!!!!

Orangenz, I'd give you 5 likes if I could. That was unquestionably my biggest annoyance with the cam and it's now gone. :):);)

Had me stumped too. Still, it shows that the default action with the menu popping up and zebras disappearing is still something that needs fixing, imho. Moving to the dial is more a workaround. But having said that, I definitely prefer it, especially as the roll menu doesn't show up at all now. No extra button pushes!

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Pretty honest appraisal of the camera at its current state. They say full hdmi for production is a big deal but that image still suffers from magenta and cyan macroblocking in V-log at 10bit. Hopefully, the summer firmware takes full advantage of the 10bit and sorts this out or else besides the 4k 60p is this camera worth twice the cost of the g85?

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