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Germy1979

GH5 10-bit 4:2:2 internal?

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9 hours ago, AaronChicago said:

4K 60p bit seems nearly impossible on GH4 sized body. Unless they have a new way to dispense heat.

No. All that is required is next generation silicon with lower power requirements. Panasonic apparently have one of the most advanced processors in any camera (except perhaps the one in the NX1) in the GH4, and that is two years older now. They likely have more modern components now with lower power requirements (which consequently can be pushed more and remain in an acceptable operating thermal envelope).

6 hours ago, aldolega said:

IBIS would be really nice but I feel like if it was included, and the rumors were accurate, they definitely would have mentioned it. Maybe 4K60 and 6K30 generates too much heat for the sensor to be floating so it's not possible. If so I would expect the G7 replacement to have it, but be limited to 4K30 like the GX85.

 

The big heat source would be the processor, not the imager. I think that all of the manufacturers can shoot 4K60p with the sensors they have, they just can't do it without melting down their processors (unless they do a software solution like Canon).

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1 hour ago, tugela said:

No. All that is required is next generation silicon with lower power requirements. Panasonic apparently have one of the most advanced processors in any camera (except perhaps the one in the NX1) in the GH4, and that is two years older now. They likely have more modern components now with lower power requirements (which consequently can be pushed more and remain in an acceptable operating thermal envelope).

The big heat source would be the processor, not the imager. I think that all of the manufacturers can shoot 4K60p with the sensors they have, they just can't do it without melting down their processors (unless they do a software solution like Canon).

A rumor from July said that the GH5 processor would be "a new very powerful processor engine" and that that's how it would obtain IQ gains. Although the same rumor says the sensor would be 99% like the GX80/85. :\

http://www.43rumors.com/ft5-panasonic-gh5/

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6 hours ago, sgreszcz said:

I'm just curious in which ways Panasonic cameras are severely deficient to Sony in stills photography?  In most ways except for ultra-shallow DoF or phase-detection C-AF for sports there is probably not a lot of difference?  Panasonic (and Olympus) have some excellent native lenses too.

If the Gx80 is any indication, the battery life is much worse than it was on my Gx7 and LX100 (same battery type).  The IBIS is surely one of the causes, and any time I forget to shut it off for something like longer time lapses, it runs down so fast.  I am working on an external battery feed from USB battery bank.

There's plenty of material on-line comparing high-res full frame to m4/3 for photography.  When it comes to low light performance, resolution, dynamic range and tonality, the A7Rii competes with medium format while m4/3 is closer in performance to 1".

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Once again this clown thinks he can get away with this nonsense please Andrew call him out publicly - https://youtu.be/FrYui231Wyc

6 hours ago, wobba said:

There's plenty of material on-line comparing high-res full frame to m4/3 for photography.  When it comes to low light performance, resolution, dynamic range and tonality, the A7Rii competes with medium format while m4/3 is closer in performance to 1".

Yea no, lol. Current MFT and APS-C sensor are just about indistiguinshable. 1" sensors are about as good as two year old APS-C chips. And fullframe just barely surpasses current APS-C. Barely. Check out Aron J Anderson on YouTube and look at the results he gets with a MFT sensor vs APSC. I'm just realllllllllyyyyy hoping they put IBIS into the GH5

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5 minutes ago, SullyCortez said:

Once again this clown thinks he can get away with this nonsense please Andrew call him out publicly - https://youtu.be/FrYui231Wyc

It was quickly called out on the biggest m4/3 and GH5 rumor source. So I doubt anyone believes it.

http://www.43rumors.com/ft5-first-images-new-panasonic-gh5-full-specs/

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49 minutes ago, BucksterUK said:

called out -did it need to be ? did you watch the video ?

 

Hahaha, people are so quick to get angry and offended, they just see the video title and get the pitchfork.

It's a good parody...

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Whilst the rumoured and specs are looking tasty, it will all come down to one thing: the image.

I was a GH3 owner due to the nice 1080p and 60fps that barely any other small camera had at the time.  However I didn't upgrade to the GH4 because I found the image to be very very very similar to the GH3. Of course, in 4k it looked way more detailed - but  it wasn't a huge leap in the overall image. The lowlight on the GH4 was actually worse. 

Also I feel 10-bit is way better implemented in some cameras than others. For example, the 10-bit in FS7 is significantly better than the FS5's 10-bit. Better codec and more data. 

For those who have the GH4 and an external recorder, have you found the 10-bit to be a big step up? Does V-log grade nicely from the external recording? If the implementation of 10-bit in the GH5 falls back on the codec and bitrate, it becomes a far less exciting camera. So it's worth knowing how the GH4 performs with it's 10-bit signal to ProRes recording. 

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1 hour ago, Oliver Daniel said:

However I didn't upgrade to the GH4 because I found the image to be very very very similar to the GH3. Of course, in 4k it looked way more detailed - but  it wasn't a huge leap in the overall image. The lowlight on the GH4 was actually worse.

GH4 low light is better, GH3 exhibited a lot of noise and banding at ISO 6400 in contrast GH4 is quite usable. On default camera profiles, GH4 ISO 6400 looks roughly as good as ISO 3200 on GH3. I know this because I've owed both cameras.

4K was a huge thing, 96 fps in FHD is also very nice for slow motion, the screen was better and did not fall apart after one year, the hot shoe the same, the EVF was much improved, the AF the same, the sound also got better, the colors, BW and the overall image were also much improved, etc, etc.

GH3 was OK, but I wasn't so impressed wit it, GH4 on the other hand was and still is a very nice and reliable camera!

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3 minutes ago, Eno said:

GH4 low light is better, GH3 exhibited a lot of noise and banding at ISO 6400 in contrast GH4 is quite usable. On default camera profiles, GH4 ISO 6400 looks roughly as good as ISO 3200 on GH3. I know this because I've owed both cameras.

4K was a huge thing, 96 fps in FHD is also very nice for slow motion, the screen was better and did not fall apart after one year, the hot shoe the same, the EVF was much improved, the AF the same, the sound also got better, the colors, BW and the overall image were also much improved, etc, etc.

GH3 was OK, but I wasn't so impressed wit it, GH4 on the other hand was and still is a very nice and reliable camera!

I was talking about the image itself - overall improvements are to be expected of a new body. 

Based on my own needs, the 4k image of the GH4 wasn't enough for me to consider an upgrade. 

I expect the GH5 will have a different body this time, and hopefully a considerably better image! ;) 

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35 minutes ago, Oliver Daniel said:

Based on my own needs, the 4k image of the GH4 wasn't enough for me to consider an upgrade.

Yes, the video quality is better on Gh4 due to better processing. The still quality is only a little bit better but exhibits no banding, in contrast Gh3 "features" banding starting from ISO 6400.

I can't wait for the GH5! :)

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Can't believe we might be on the verge of a tiny camera that can shoot 4k/60p 10 bit 4:4:2 log ... possibly with ibis. 

If they get it right, this is the ultimate indie shooter.... a true game changer.

I'll grab two of these and not even look at new cameras for a good long time.

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23 hours ago, Oliver Daniel said:

Whilst the rumoured and specs are looking tasty, it will all come down to one thing: the image.

I was a GH3 owner due to the nice 1080p and 60fps that barely any other small camera had at the time.  However I didn't upgrade to the GH4 because I found the image to be very very very similar to the GH3. Of course, in 4k it looked way more detailed - but  it wasn't a huge leap in the overall image. The lowlight on the GH4 was actually worse. 

Also I feel 10-bit is way better implemented in some cameras than others. For example, the 10-bit in FS7 is significantly better than the FS5's 10-bit. Better codec and more data. 

For those who have the GH4 and an external recorder, have you found the 10-bit to be a big step up? Does V-log grade nicely from the external recording? If the implementation of 10-bit in the GH5 falls back on the codec and bitrate, it becomes a far less exciting camera. So it's worth knowing how the GH4 performs with it's 10-bit signal to ProRes recording. 

In my opinion V Log makes the GH4 a competitor to Blackmagic in terms of color. The biggest problem is that the image is pretty brittle. 10 bit definitely helps, but something about it is still not as sturdy as a BM ProRes file. If they can figure this issue out they'll have a monster on their hands.

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1 hour ago, Jimmy said:

Maybe the rumour dude just forgot to mention it... would be a ridiculous thing to leave out of the flagship model

GH line never had IBIS. Previous GX cameras have it. I think that's the way panasonic differentiates camera lines and features.  

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5 hours ago, Hanriverprod said:

No mention for IBIS for g80 or gh5. gx85 users are trumpeting it on their cameras. Maybe they left it off because of the heat and also to keep users on their lenses? Is that a possibility?

It is very likely that either Panasonic doesn't include IBIS or has an option to switch it off during recordings. The IBIS has 2 main issues:

1. Heat issues (especially in a weather-sealed 4k camera, and one that does 4-2-2 10-bit Internally); and 

2. Noise: If the GH5 is to have usable sound from a mic mounted on the camera (via a camera plugged into the camera's mic socket), then the IBIS noise may be an issue (unless some shotgun mic can completely isolate the sound from the camera).

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