Brad Bjornstad Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I've always liked the look of Red cameras (not as well as ARRI mind you), and so far the camera looks pretty darn good. Even their "inexpensive" models cost quite a bit when you actually get them ready to shoot... but if you have the funds to procure one, they are beautiful!Having said that, I love my NX1 and a7S combo myself Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zak Forsman Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Okay the acting was good up to a point, and for some reason I feel like the girl character was unnecessary. I mean Christ. My cinematographer response is yeah the Raven looks great, but my audience response is that the short is falling a bit flat. My God, the girl is just standing there while her brother is about to have the chance to get murdered and her grandfather is about to lose a sentimental meaning vehicle. Who in the world would really act like that in that situation? This is getting freaking stupid. And geeze.....................................Do................................People................................Talk................................Like......................This......................All...........................The.............................Time................. Okay it got interesting the next point when the girl starting having a meaning... Still the acting is crappy... I'd give this a 5 out of 10. Raven looks great, but acting and story needs WORK.Not Raven. C300 MKII. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertonesx24 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 This is one of those times when story doesn't matter. People just want to see how it'll look in a pro environment. Look's damn good in my opinion.Any camera will look great in a pro environment. If you have production design, makeup, costumes, and sets on the level of this video, and the crew and the budget to support it, you'll get something that looks damn good.Something like this meant to fool the 90% of creatives who spend their hours wondering why their content sucks, and then they see this, so obviously, it must be that they are not using RED Ed_David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronChicago Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Any camera will look great in a pro environment. If you have production design, makeup, costumes, and sets on the level of this video, and the crew and the budget to support it, you'll get something that looks damn good.Something like this meant to fool the 90% of creatives who spend their hours wondering why their content sucks, and then they see this, so obviously, it must be that they are not using REDWhat other company has done this though? I can't think of any other promo that looks that good. Canon, Panasonic, Samsung, all botch theirs in a "professional environment". Sony has had a couple of good ones for the higher end cameras. andrgl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viet Bach Bui Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The problem with having a heavily produced promo for a low-budget camera is that its intended target most likely can't afford that level of production, while those with the budget to do so generally wouldn't bother with a budget camera. Ed_David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronChicago Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 The problem with having a heavily produced promo for a low-budget camera is that its intended target most likely can't afford that level of production, while those with the budget to do so generally wouldn't bother with a budget camera.i wouldn't call it a budget camera. $10,000 is a pretty penny these days. Plenty of mid to high level productions will use it im sure. Even as a B cam to an Epic. andrgl 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmcindie Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 I can't think of any other promo that looks that good. Canon, Panasonic, Samsung, all botch theirs in a "professional environment". Sony has had a couple of good ones for the higher end cameras.That's because they hire people who are not very good at their job. Canon probably didn't pay them that much so they just did it with their left hand and the director just either didn't care about highlights being blown or anything really. Though even if they paid those guys more I don't think the end result would've been any better. They could've gotten something by being smart with who they hire to promote. They weren't, they went the easiest route.The owners of RED do have an eye for these things. Their ad is clearly meant to showcase the camera, nothing else. The C300 II commercial isn't even trying. It tries to be a narrative but it really isn't and the shots themselves are very, very ordinary. Bad even. Grading is very amateurish on the C300 II ad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AaronChicago Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 That's because they hire people who are not very good at their job. Canon probably didn't pay them that much so they just did it with their left hand and the director just either didn't care about highlights being blown or anything really. Though even if they paid those guys more I don't think the end result would've been any better. They could've gotten something by being smart with who they hire to promote. They weren't, they went the easiest route.The owners of RED do have an eye for these things. Their ad is clearly meant to showcase the camera, nothing else. The C300 II commercial isn't even trying. It tries to be a narrative but it really isn't and the shots themselves are very, very ordinary. Bad even. Grading is very amateurish on the C300 II ad. Yep, and RED has said that it was their team that shot it. I'm genuinely curious to see if the theory is true about using a low budget camera (sub $3000) on a high end production, to promote it, causes an influx in sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silvertonesx24 Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 What other company has done this though? I can't think of any other promo that looks that good. Canon, Panasonic, Samsung, all botch theirs in a "professional environment". Sony has had a couple of good ones for the higher end cameras.They hired Peter Jackson to shoot a short film for their Red One promo.They are literally the Rolex of the camera world. Most people think they are the end-all-be-all, especially those on the periphery of the world, when they are neither high nor low; they just know how to brand far more effectively than anyone else. Ed_David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted December 9, 2015 Author Share Posted December 9, 2015 Yea, the guy knows how to market... That's how he could sell plastic shite sunglasses for $100s Ed_David 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicolas MAILLET Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Yea, the guy knows how to market... That's how he could sell plastic shite sunglasses for $100sJimmy you are totally right about this.But let's see the footage as it is : well done and beautiful. it is a fact. Maybe a BM 4.6k camera could do the same... True. But for instance this Raven footage looks good to me.Marketing just speaks to who wants to hear it... When i have to use a camera for the first time, i test it to see myself what it does have in the belly. Harsh test !!! Then marketing is just something i don't have in mind when testing... We all know this. When i see someone doing skateboard like a god, i can easily think i couldn't do the same if i use the same board... I just don't have skills to do the same... I think this work the same for cameras... It needs work to have the same results... Marketing is everywhere... i make commercials... and some clients have some great ideas and concepts to make you use things to be a better guy with some shitty stuff... lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted December 9, 2015 Author Share Posted December 9, 2015 I like to see the camera in question working at full potential, in these promo vids. As long as there is not extremely excessive and expensive post trickery involved, i think it is fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRenaissanceMan Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Yeah, Panasonic has no idea how to create promos for their pro-level products. https://vimeo.com/105522587 https://vimeo.com/112329673 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ed_David Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 The red one mx will give a better image. Better motion cadence. Less fan issues. Multiple hd sdi out. Raven is lighter but probably will have terrible fan issues and no audio in maybe and other crappiness.Wait till it comes out. Until then it doesnt exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrgl Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 no audio in maybe and other crappiness.It does audio. From the site:Integrated dual channel digital stereo microphones, uncompressed, 24-bit 48 kHz.Optional 2 additional channels with Expander Module, uncompressed, 24-bit 48 kHz. What it does poorly is slo-mo. It's super compressed. The Raven is the ultimate crash/fly cam. Which means it's useful for about 2% of this forum. That said, at 10k for an almost complete kit, it's a pretty sweet deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted December 10, 2015 Author Share Posted December 10, 2015 The Raven is the ultimate crash/fly cam. Which means it's useful for about 2% of this forum.Or anyone who shoots at 24fps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andrgl Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Or anyone who shoots at 24fpsDoesn't it do 120 fps lossy at full resolution?Edit: yup, it does at 15:1. Last time I shot the shit with a DP that shoots lots of Red, I was told you could basically get visually lossless with 8:1, so it'd be interesting to see what a 15:1 capture looks like. I'm not defending the Raven by any stretch, it's just, just, just out of my budget because of shit like: proprietary media, proprietary media off-loader, oh and probably the redcode card or whatever they call it. So much extra $$$ required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Posted December 10, 2015 Author Share Posted December 10, 2015 From what I have read, the 15:1 is quite usable... I;m in no way technical, but read that the weapon has a few tricks up it's sleeve to get a better image than 15:1 in Epic.... zero idea of how much truth there is to that though.I've used mx quite a bit and heavier compression is certainly noticeable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axel Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 I'm not defending the Raven by any stretch, it's just, just, just out of my budget because of shit like: proprietary media, proprietary media off-loader, oh and probably the redcode card or whatever they call it. So much extra $$$ required.Yes, for me too. Out of reach. Fully equipped (with two no-name V-mount batteries and four 256 GB cards, BM viewfinder, shoulder kit and battery plate), the Ursa Mini 4,6k is roughly €10.000. How much would the Raven be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil A Posted December 10, 2015 Share Posted December 10, 2015 Yes, for me too. Out of reach. Fully equipped (with two no-name V-mount batteries and four 256 GB cards, BM viewfinder, shoulder kit and battery plate), the Ursa Mini 4,6k is roughly €10.000. How much would the Raven be? Well the I/O basic package is €10000. Then you have to add 4 x €1350 (which is think is ridiculous) for the 240 GB Red MiniMags in addition to the 120GB included in the package. The EVF on top is another €2055 - 4260 depending which one you take. Shoulder pad on top we can probably say you look at nearly double the cost for an identical package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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