tony wilson Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 airspaced correction does not have to be a thick cemented doublet these anamorphic optics are achromatic airspaced single element optics do you really think slr magic produced a cemented doublet anamorphic in that short time frame? it was either 2 separate pieces of bk7 or a copy of the optex 2 different glass types (airspaced achromat) with a variable focus tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony wilson Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 blockquote class="ipsBlockquote" data-author="JohnBarlow" data-cid="23633" data-time="1355687630"><br /> <p>Close up lens' below 1.0 diotr do not require to be achromatic as there is no CA to correct</p><br /> <really wow i suppose i better refund all those folks i have sold tokina achromats to : ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 really wow i suppose i better refund all those folks i have sold tokina achromats to : ) no need to get snarky, just sayin Nikon only went with achros on the higher dioptr range Ref http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf2/macro/index3a.htm and Zeiss Proxars for Hasselblad were all single element I believe Nizo (Schneiders) were the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richg101 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 no need to get snarky, just sayin Nikon only went with achros on the higher dioptr range Ref http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/hardwares/classics/nikonf2/macro/index3a.htm and Zeiss Proxars for Hasselblad were all single element I believe Nizo (Schneiders) were the same Those diopters wont apply any improvement to the sharpness and CA on a century or la7200. the tokina achromatic actually sharpens them overall. even at near infinity, the tokina +0.4 improves the century when used on aps-c. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Those diopters wont apply any improvement to the sharpness and CA on a century or la7200. the tokina achromatic actually sharpens them overall. even at near infinity, the tokina +0.4 improves the century when used on aps-c. The best way to improve the sharpness on those adapters is , IMO, is to remove them and simply crop the image. Those adapters were designed for the format change from 4:3 to 16:9 and not for their scope properties. Back in the day I had an Optex on a PD150 and it was a pain to use zoomed in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richg101 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 The best way to improve the sharpness on those adapters is , IMO, is to remove them and simply crop the image. You're in the wrong forum then. i think everyone here knows that cropping the image will yield sharper results. degradation of sharpness is a sacrifice everyone here is willing to make. even without the oval bokeh, the la7200 and century still provide the real flares and a organic look that cannot be replicated in software. the tokina sharpens the century very well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 You're in the wrong forum then. i think everyone here knows that cropping the image will yield sharper results. degradation of sharpness is a sacrifice everyone here is willing to make. even without the oval bokeh, the la7200 and century still provide the real flares and a organic look that cannot be replicated in software. the tokina sharpens the century very well I dont believe I am in the wrong Forum unless you speak for Andrew. Anamorphic Cinemascope is and always will be 2x including flares, stretched Bokeh, and 2:1 elliptical aperture reflection Anything else is a small format cheapskate pretender to the real deal. Like a Porshe 944 hairdressers car :) just sayin' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richg101 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 I dont believe I am in the wrong Forum unless you speak for Andrew. Anamorphic Cinemascope is and always will be 2x including flares, stretched Bokeh, and 2:1 elliptical aperture reflection Anything else is a small format cheapskate pretender to the real deal. Like a Porshe 944 hairdressers car :) just sayin' You're spurting ignorant things my friend. I'm unable to shoot on an Alexa studio, and unable to shoot on 4perf 35mm film meaing for me, 2x is too much squeeze. Most people here are in the same boat as me. But we make do, and actually create things on our 'cheapskate pretender' rigs. You on the other hand create nothing and instead just come here to stir up trouble with ignorant statements. As far as hairdressers cars are concerned, you're comparison is pretty dumb. I'd rather a hairdressers car than no car at all. Go start a topic on the forums for real cinematographers and leave us cheapskate pretenders alone. We are not worthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 I will not descend to your level by returning your personal insults, but I will remind you of the banner at the top of this forum which reads The Anamorphic Shooter's Forum The place to discuss all things anamorphic. Lenses, workflow, cameras - it all goes here. Only people who think in wider than 2.35:1 allowed! Lets just repeat the last sentence just in case you missed it " Only people who think in wider than 2.35:1 allowed! " Get it? Quite clearly you don't, so....Seems to me - you're a gatecrasher :) You're spurting ignorant things my friend. I'm unable to shoot on an Alexa studio, and unable to shoot on 4perf 35mm film meaing for me, 2x is too much squeeze. Most people here are in the same boat as me. But we make do, and actually create things on our 'cheapskate pretender' rigs. You on the other hand create nothing and instead just come here to stir up trouble with ignorant statements. As far as hairdressers cars are concerned, you're comparison is pretty dumb. I'd rather a hairdressers car than no car at all. Go start a topic on the forums for real cinematographers and leave us cheapskate pretenders alone. We are not worthy I will not descend to return your insults Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richg101 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Muppet The chain of events goes as follows:- You respond to the topic suggesting achromatic diopters are not required with anything less than +1 magnification which was wrong in this instance. I correct you and explain that the tokina +0.4 actually is beneficial being achromatic. Upon your authority being questioned, you came up with another bold and ignorant suggestion that anamorphic with less squeeze than 2x is for 'cheapskates'. Then try and make a comparison between a choice of lens and a choice of automobile... baffling! I correct you again, and inform you that your comments are ignorant. ig·no·rant /ˈignərənt/ : Lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about something in particular You suggest i am being insulting to you. Never expect to come onto a forum spurting ignorant and bold things without expecting to come away feeling insulted. I did not mean to insult you, but more to make others aware that your suggestions are made based on ignorant opinion and not real life experiences. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Are you in for a surprise! :) Muppet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Cunningham Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 The best way to improve the sharpness on those adapters is , IMO, is to remove them and simply crop the image. .. Horse shit. richg101 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richg101 Posted December 16, 2012 Share Posted December 16, 2012 Horse shit. I bet you drive a Porsche 944 like me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Ok Now we are in the guilt phase followed by more insults ?? :) " Only people who think in wider than 2.35:1 allowed! " Get it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Cunningham Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 I bet you drive a Porsche 944 like me! I used to. Fantastic handling car, unlike its contemporaries that get more respect from the hard park Porsche snobs. I'll own another one again one of these days but it won't be an "S" model. Fatal design flaws in the engine, from a maintenance standpoint, and mechanics qualified and experienced in the water-cooled engines are near extinction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Cunningham Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Ok Now we are in the guilt phase followed by more insults ?? :) " Only people who think in wider than 2.35:1 allowed! " Get it? How ironic. This guy would show the door to someone with a Panaflex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Whats this? "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" youre kiddin me right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Oh yeah Stroke my Hawk its really friendly once you get to handle it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony wilson Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 <p>mr barlow..</p> <p>you are clever i believe..</p> <p> </p> <p>if you have got single element or achromatic doublets and the time to do some tests with anamorphic and double element single element close up combos.</p> <p>if not </p> <p> </p> <p> </p> <p>do tests in zemax software.</p> <p>input single element information then try a doublet design.</p> <p>see what the results show..</p> <p> </p> <p> </p> <p>i remember you got upset because slr magic did not take your technical advice probably was good advice but do something with your concepts and ideas.</p> <p>do it yourself and prove everyone wrong.</p> <p> </p> <p>i have many double element close up's.</p> <p>+0.3..</p> <p>+0.4</p> <p>+0.8</p> <p>and +1</p> <p>they are all superior to any single element i have.</p> <p>maybe it does not matter if you are viewing clips on an iphone.</p> <p>i think you will find maybe many companies did not make them because of hassle and cost. </p> <p> </p> <p>and the old method of stopping down as a solution for correcting error.</p> <p> </p> <p>companies like ikegami,fujinon,cooke,isco,angenieux,pentax,elcan leica canada,pacific optical all made low power doublets.</p> <p>for tv and military contracts.</p> <p>clearly industries where quality trumped price point.</p> <p> </p> <p>are doublets vital no.</p> <p>but the very nature of the design requires more care and attention during manufacture.</p> <p>no cuttings corners here.</p> <p>china sells a shit 4 dollar single element close up every 10 secs so who got the math correct clearly china.</p> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBarlow Posted December 17, 2012 Share Posted December 17, 2012 Mr Wilson, I congratulate you on returning this thread to a more civil tone, which I wholly support. I stand by my previous comment on the need for achromat below1.0 dioptr, so no need for a theoretical treatise. If your concern is quality then yes, you get what you pay for and I believe the current favoured solution in Motion Picture and TV is the Schneider water white optical glass single element solution https://www.schneideroptics.com/ecommerce/CatalogSubCategoryDisplay.aspx?CID=1662 Personally, I use Zeiss T* Proxars on my sweet little sixteens. I love the bayonet quick change....... Referring to SLR Magic, I was not upset but took a firm stance on why he was sending me PMs but blanking me on the forum. Funny thing was, he was asking about close ups as well. I do not take SLR Magic seriously however and have yet to see any photos OF his prototype so who really knows what was used in the production of the photos he posted. "if it ain't on the page - it ain't on the stage" As for proving people wrong, that's not my gig, they are well aware of the written word. I will make you aware of two products I will be releasing in Q1/13 when a Press Release will be sent out. One is related to scopes and the other related to cine lenses. mr barlow.. you are clever i believe.. if you have not got single element or achromatic doublets or the time to do some tests with anamorphic and double element single element close up combos. do it in zemax software. input single element information then try a doublet design. see what the results show.. i remember you got upset because slr magic did not take your technical advice probably was good advice but do something with your concepts and ideas. do it yourself and prove everyone wrong. i have many double element close up's. +0.3.. +0.4 +0.8 and +1 they are all superior to any single element i have. maybe it does not matter if you are viewing clips on an iphone. i think you will find maybe many companies did not make them because of hassle and cost. and the old method of stopping down as a solution for correcting error. companies like ikegami,fujinon,cooke,isco,angenieux,pentax,elcan leica canada,pacific optical all made low power doublets. for tv and military contracts. clearly industries where quality trumped price point. are doublets vital no. but the very nature of the design requires more care and attention during manufacture. no cuttings corners here. china sells a shit 4 dollar single element close up every 10 secs so who got the math correct clearly china. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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