crevice

Do you guys really propose to assess a camera's "color science" by referencing one highly stylized and heavily color corrected beauty shot, at a complete remove from the naturalistic norms of modern-day dramatic cinematography?
And what's the ideal?  Accurate color or stylized color?
 By tomorrow morning, the forums will be full of people insisting that the S1H is as good as the Red Dragon and the skin tones on the BMPCC 4K are crap.  I read it on the internet.....

Lengthy review on newshooter - its crazy how much better the S1H looks than the A7 and Nikon camera in the talking head comparison video. Also, not sure I agree with him on the "Sterile" look, pocket 6k seems just as sterile if not more to me. Though, to his credit I have seen lots of footage with the S1H that can look sterile in the wrong hands. 
 
https://www.newsshooter.com/2019/11/11/panasonic-lumix-s1h-review/?fbclid=IwAR2RI5AXLl9Hlbqfir20uerkbnS8IdiI9oVd7ctgsP5WGJDJ-O3zMgJqgN0

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

firmware announced, but oddly no mention for S1H. Update notes do mention a fix for blue clipping in vlog and a fix for afterimage, which I believe is the ghosting issue seen by some. 
 
https://m.dpreview.com/news/0778308148/panasonic-adds-features-with-firmware-for-gh5-gh5s-g9-s1-and-s1r-with-particular-boost-for-g9-video

firmware announced, but oddly no mention for S1H. Update notes do mention a fix for blue clipping in vlog and a fix for afterimage, which I believe is the ghosting issue seen by some. 
 
https://m.dpreview.com/news/0778308148/panasonic-adds-features-with-firmware-for-gh5-gh5s-g9-s1-and-s1r-with-particular-boost-for-g9-video

This is a creative art form we take on as filmmakers - I see nothing wrong with the approach by the filmmaker or the grade, if that was their vision.

Hey Mercer - hopefully you can keep it and make something. I have recently come to the conclusion that buying and selling is having a negative impact on my creativity. That may seem obvious, but I am slowly starting to just keep all my cameras and various systems and use them as tools for what they are good at when the time comes. I used to be really paranoid about having more than one camera brand - but now, I don't care - obviously if finances allow. 

This is a creative art form we take on as filmmakers - I see nothing wrong with the approach by the filmmaker or the grade, if that was their vision.

This is a creative art form we take on as filmmakers - I see nothing wrong with the approach by the filmmaker or the grade, if that was their vision.

We must have had the exact same courier. In fact, it seems that you, me, and all the rest of the over hundred people complaining in the FB groups about scuffed and dented cameras were by the same courier. I am sure this has nothing to do with them re-using the plastic housing from pocket 4k returns for "brand new" pocket 6k bodies. I am also sure it has nothing to do with their shit packaging. No, this has nothing to do with that. 

Hey Mercer - hopefully you can keep it and make something. I have recently come to the conclusion that buying and selling is having a negative impact on my creativity. That may seem obvious, but I am slowly starting to just keep all my cameras and various systems and use them as tools for what they are good at when the time comes. I used to be really paranoid about having more than one camera brand - but now, I don't care - obviously if finances allow. 

Not mine, but this was 90 percent shot on the original bmpcc with 1 lens
 
 

Not mine, but this was 90 percent shot on the original bmpcc with 1 lens
 
 

Your positives about the S1H are everything I would want in a camera. Your negatives, which I have yet to encounter, should be fixed in a firmware update as they seem to be directly tied to VLOG, which is a positive since its something that could be fixed, similar to the GH5. With that said, you have brought up a valid concern - but  you have brought it up over and over and over, to the point where we get it, but we are not Panasonic - you should be voicing this to them at this point in order to actually get it fixed. If you have already and they are aware, then you should give them time to fix it. There has yet to be a first real firmware out yet to even see if its addressed. To be clear, I have no issues at all with you voicing concerns that need to be fixed, nothing will get fixed if we are all silent. But you made your point and now you are just stating the same thing over and over again, in this forum, on facebook, on review sites, etc. I am not sure what you want out of it. Are you hoping Panasonic read and fix it? If so, why not just contact them?
Lastly, I disagree with your notion of the pocket 6k or any of these mirrorless cameras, including the S1H, having an "organic" image. An organic image to me, would be an original Blackmagic pocket, Blackmagic micro, Blackmagic cinema 2.5. Those actually used a Fairchild sensor and had a nice organic look to it. You didn't need to add grain to those those cameras to make them look organic, it was organic out the box. 
 

Your positives about the S1H are everything I would want in a camera. Your negatives, which I have yet to encounter, should be fixed in a firmware update as they seem to be directly tied to VLOG, which is a positive since its something that could be fixed, similar to the GH5. With that said, you have brought up a valid concern - but  you have brought it up over and over and over, to the point where we get it, but we are not Panasonic - you should be voicing this to them at this point in order to actually get it fixed. If you have already and they are aware, then you should give them time to fix it. There has yet to be a first real firmware out yet to even see if its addressed. To be clear, I have no issues at all with you voicing concerns that need to be fixed, nothing will get fixed if we are all silent. But you made your point and now you are just stating the same thing over and over again, in this forum, on facebook, on review sites, etc. I am not sure what you want out of it. Are you hoping Panasonic read and fix it? If so, why not just contact them?
Lastly, I disagree with your notion of the pocket 6k or any of these mirrorless cameras, including the S1H, having an "organic" image. An organic image to me, would be an original Blackmagic pocket, Blackmagic micro, Blackmagic cinema 2.5. Those actually used a Fairchild sensor and had a nice organic look to it. You didn't need to add grain to those those cameras to make them look organic, it was organic out the box. 
 

I get around 2 hours on one battery

Are we sure they know about it? If you or anyone has contacted them, can you share the best contact method so we can all flood their inboxes? I don’t need any internal noise reduction ever, if I want to use it I’ll do it In post. If it’s an option turn on or off, that’s best of both worlds. Panasonic needs to be near perfect with their full frame venture as their competition is stiff and they can’t afford this issue to linger and become more of a thing. Turn off noise reduction, put out a firmware update, let’s move on. End of Next year or 2021, put out an S2H with phase detect and then we are all happy campers and roasting marshmallows together and singing songs of celebration. 

It’s a fantastic looking camera. Unfortunately most the people uploading footage with it on YouTube (this video being the exception) have no clue what they are doing. From incorrect shutter angles, horrible rec 709 LUTs, no clue how to grade or expose, etc. I am blown away by the colors and look.

They are different. The Micro nails a filmic look that none of these modern cameras achieve out the box. Its gritty, raw, and has a very organic feel to it. But, it doesn't have IBIS, does not shoot photos, shoot 4k, etc. The S1H has a very nice cinematic look to it as well, but it's not as "filmic" and gritty like the micro. Colors of the S1H still amazing though and I prefer the colors of the S1H more than the Pocket 4k/6k new color science (I owned both).
With all that said, the S1H has so much going for it that my micro will only get used for certain situations and most likely not run and gun anymore. I have to use the micro on a ronin-s as there are way too many micro jitters hand held. Coming from Blackmagic and Sony cameras, I can't stress enough how unbelievable the IBIS of the S1H is, especially dual IS with their 24-105. There is no need for a gimbal unless you need slider like shots or walking shots. For stationary, short walks, pans, etc., there is no absolutely no need for a gimbal/monopod/shoulder rig, that's how steady it is. The footage looks incredible, especially if you know what you are doing and how to properly expose vlog and convert it rec. 709 with the proper varicam LUTs.
More importantly for my decision to make this my main camera is that I take photos as well and the one thing I was pleasantly surprised about with this camera is how good the autofocus for photos is considering all the complaints. The autofocus for video is horrible, but I manual focus for video. But for photos, it was MUCH better than I thought after listening to everyone complain. Eye auto focus works great as well. Not as good as my A7R3, but still really good. Another thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is how fast it can switch between custom modes, for example I have a video mode on the dial and a photo mode that I switch between. Video mode has vlog, 180 degree shutter, different settings etc that I keep static and photo mode has none of that. When I switch between them it is seamless, no loading, no screen blackout, none of that. It is instant and quick and I can switch back and forth instantly. 
To me, I look at the cost of $4000 different than most. Unlike when I shot with a pocket 4/6k or even the micro - I don't need to carry a gimbal or shoulder rig, I don't need to mount a heavy v-mount battery on the back, I don't need an external monitor if I want to tilt or rotate it (I still do for the large screen, but its not necessary), and I don't need to bring a second body and lenses if I want to take photos. On top of all that - I prefer the video image over the blackmagic pocket 4k and 6k. It has a nicer highlight roll off, seems like better dynamic range, and I prefer the colors. All this without shooting RAW yet. I know that was way more info than you needed, but we are so lucky to have all these tools as filmmakers now days and this is the first camera in a very very long time that has me excited like this. I have owned or shot with the Canon C200, URSA Mini Pro 4.6k, Micro Cinema Camera, Pocket 4k/6k, Red Raven, A7R3, A7S2, A73. This is the first camera out of all of those where I can simply pack the camera and a lens and have what I need for a day of video and photos without a bag full of stabilization gear and photo gear mixed with video gear. 

They are different. The Micro nails a filmic look that none of these modern cameras achieve out the box. Its gritty, raw, and has a very organic feel to it. But, it doesn't have IBIS, does not shoot photos, shoot 4k, etc. The S1H has a very nice cinematic look to it as well, but it's not as "filmic" and gritty like the micro. Colors of the S1H still amazing though and I prefer the colors of the S1H more than the Pocket 4k/6k new color science (I owned both).
With all that said, the S1H has so much going for it that my micro will only get used for certain situations and most likely not run and gun anymore. I have to use the micro on a ronin-s as there are way too many micro jitters hand held. Coming from Blackmagic and Sony cameras, I can't stress enough how unbelievable the IBIS of the S1H is, especially dual IS with their 24-105. There is no need for a gimbal unless you need slider like shots or walking shots. For stationary, short walks, pans, etc., there is no absolutely no need for a gimbal/monopod/shoulder rig, that's how steady it is. The footage looks incredible, especially if you know what you are doing and how to properly expose vlog and convert it rec. 709 with the proper varicam LUTs.
More importantly for my decision to make this my main camera is that I take photos as well and the one thing I was pleasantly surprised about with this camera is how good the autofocus for photos is considering all the complaints. The autofocus for video is horrible, but I manual focus for video. But for photos, it was MUCH better than I thought after listening to everyone complain. Eye auto focus works great as well. Not as good as my A7R3, but still really good. Another thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is how fast it can switch between custom modes, for example I have a video mode on the dial and a photo mode that I switch between. Video mode has vlog, 180 degree shutter, different settings etc that I keep static and photo mode has none of that. When I switch between them it is seamless, no loading, no screen blackout, none of that. It is instant and quick and I can switch back and forth instantly. 
To me, I look at the cost of $4000 different than most. Unlike when I shot with a pocket 4/6k or even the micro - I don't need to carry a gimbal or shoulder rig, I don't need to mount a heavy v-mount battery on the back, I don't need an external monitor if I want to tilt or rotate it (I still do for the large screen, but its not necessary), and I don't need to bring a second body and lenses if I want to take photos. On top of all that - I prefer the video image over the blackmagic pocket 4k and 6k. It has a nicer highlight roll off, seems like better dynamic range, and I prefer the colors. All this without shooting RAW yet. I know that was way more info than you needed, but we are so lucky to have all these tools as filmmakers now days and this is the first camera in a very very long time that has me excited like this. I have owned or shot with the Canon C200, URSA Mini Pro 4.6k, Micro Cinema Camera, Pocket 4k/6k, Red Raven, A7R3, A7S2, A73. This is the first camera out of all of those where I can simply pack the camera and a lens and have what I need for a day of video and photos without a bag full of stabilization gear and photo gear mixed with video gear. 

They are different. The Micro nails a filmic look that none of these modern cameras achieve out the box. Its gritty, raw, and has a very organic feel to it. But, it doesn't have IBIS, does not shoot photos, shoot 4k, etc. The S1H has a very nice cinematic look to it as well, but it's not as "filmic" and gritty like the micro. Colors of the S1H still amazing though and I prefer the colors of the S1H more than the Pocket 4k/6k new color science (I owned both).
With all that said, the S1H has so much going for it that my micro will only get used for certain situations and most likely not run and gun anymore. I have to use the micro on a ronin-s as there are way too many micro jitters hand held. Coming from Blackmagic and Sony cameras, I can't stress enough how unbelievable the IBIS of the S1H is, especially dual IS with their 24-105. There is no need for a gimbal unless you need slider like shots or walking shots. For stationary, short walks, pans, etc., there is no absolutely no need for a gimbal/monopod/shoulder rig, that's how steady it is. The footage looks incredible, especially if you know what you are doing and how to properly expose vlog and convert it rec. 709 with the proper varicam LUTs.
More importantly for my decision to make this my main camera is that I take photos as well and the one thing I was pleasantly surprised about with this camera is how good the autofocus for photos is considering all the complaints. The autofocus for video is horrible, but I manual focus for video. But for photos, it was MUCH better than I thought after listening to everyone complain. Eye auto focus works great as well. Not as good as my A7R3, but still really good. Another thing I haven't heard anyone talk about is how fast it can switch between custom modes, for example I have a video mode on the dial and a photo mode that I switch between. Video mode has vlog, 180 degree shutter, different settings etc that I keep static and photo mode has none of that. When I switch between them it is seamless, no loading, no screen blackout, none of that. It is instant and quick and I can switch back and forth instantly. 
To me, I look at the cost of $4000 different than most. Unlike when I shot with a pocket 4/6k or even the micro - I don't need to carry a gimbal or shoulder rig, I don't need to mount a heavy v-mount battery on the back, I don't need an external monitor if I want to tilt or rotate it (I still do for the large screen, but its not necessary), and I don't need to bring a second body and lenses if I want to take photos. On top of all that - I prefer the video image over the blackmagic pocket 4k and 6k. It has a nicer highlight roll off, seems like better dynamic range, and I prefer the colors. All this without shooting RAW yet. I know that was way more info than you needed, but we are so lucky to have all these tools as filmmakers now days and this is the first camera in a very very long time that has me excited like this. I have owned or shot with the Canon C200, URSA Mini Pro 4.6k, Micro Cinema Camera, Pocket 4k/6k, Red Raven, A7R3, A7S2, A73. This is the first camera out of all of those where I can simply pack the camera and a lens and have what I need for a day of video and photos without a bag full of stabilization gear and photo gear mixed with video gear.