Geoff CB

Just now, Timotheus said:

Didn't see this before, but external BRAW seems like a pretty big deal?

https://www.slashcam.com/news/single/Nikon-Z6II-and-Z7II-with-Dual-Card-Slots-and-for-t-16118.html

Again, I would argue that for the price point they are pretty good.

It would be if Blackmagic recorders were not complete and utter garbage. I owned the 12G and it had horrific input and output lag. 

4 hours ago, Sharathc47 said:

No N-log internal

No 10bit internal 

No 6k raw (full sensor readout)

Paid raw update that too line skipped 4k

DISAPPOINTING😔

I don't think they have taken any feedback from video users.

 

 

Um yeah. I'm now going to sell all my Nikon gear.

Colossally disappointing, especially have the RAW remain a paid upgrade and no 10-bit. Hell they couldn't even remove the goddamn 30 minute time limit.  The fact this camera has NO VIDEO IMPROVMENT AT LAUNCH is tone deaf idiocy. 

Hell the 4K 60p being added later as a firmware upgrade and not being able to record it externally just feels like a final kick in the teeth.

2 hours ago, zerocool22 said:

I think chivo earned a pretty penny for this one. 

That really did not look good to me. Pretty scenery sure, but the image itself didn't blow me away. Overly sharpened with a high shutter speed, surprised he didn't use an ND on it. 

1 hour ago, sanveer said:

Why do you think Apple chose the 10-bit Dolby Vision over the 10-bit HDR10+? Do you think they've improved their video quality further? Slightly more dynamic range and maybe multi frame 10-bit? Apple seems to be be hiding some features and some tricks of the processor too. Maybe they will announce them later or they were trying to make all the phones appear similar (instead of actually 2 completely different generations of smartphones, based on camera alone). 

Possible answer, Dolby paid them. I'm someone who thinks the Dolby Vision workflow is incredible, doing HDR and SDR in single grading pass is witchcraft but their system pulls it off,  only problem with it is it is proprietary and expensive. 

3 minutes ago, ntblowz said:

I guess video RAW is different than still RAW after all?

Even with RAW stills you need to update Lightroom/Capture One/Etc. every time a new camera comes out.

1 hour ago, majoraxis said:

This youtube video lists the camera as "Ursa Mini Pro 12k".

Wow - impressive!  The color rendition is special in the way that the different shades of a color appear distinct and unique even when they are very similar.  I also like the motion cadence.  The image is solid and without distraction.  It's nice to not have any obvious flaws that steel my attention from the content.

 

While that is a beautiful video, with a fantastic grade,  I really dislike that these things are labelled "Dolby Vision." Youtube DOES NOT support Dolby Vision, only HLG, which is worse than HDR10 format in terms of image quality. It may have been graded in Dolby Vision but it is not Dolby Vision display on youtube. 

10 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Thanks, that seems to make BRAW a whole lot less "universal" than it was made out to be.

So for cameras that are capable of ProRes RAW, are they just outputting straight RAW then? 

No, none of these compressed RAW formats are actually RAW, they are compressed raw formats that toss out data. They all need to be designed on a camera by camera basis. 

38 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

I am definitely NOT an engineer. But my understanding is that the camera's DON'T output a "flavor" of RAW. Meaning, that cameras just output RAW, and they don't output ProRes RAW nor BRAW.

But then then begs the question: If they just output "generic" RAW, why can't BlackMagic capture that generic RAW and convert it to BRAW?

BRAW does not work that way, it has to be calibrated to each camera. 

When grading files in HDR, I can instantly tell when a file is of lower quality. Grading on a 8-bit timeline doesn't really show the difference, but on a 10 or 12-bit HDR timeline on a HDR panel it is night and day. 

So for me for a "Thick" image. is 10-bit 4:2:2 or better with at least 14+ Stops of DR.

35 minutes ago, Danyyyel said:

After 2 years, they should have asked for a faster one. They have devised a system to read 4k and not 6k from the full sensor for the RAW video, they should have done the same for the the 60 fps. In fact I wouldn't have mind even a 3k 120 fps. The 1080p 120 fps is surprisingly good, at 3k it would inter-cut very well with the 4k mode.

The 1080p 120 is so good I'd be happy with that if they gave me it in 10-bit log.

1 hour ago, kye said:

Actually, the fact that an image can be reduced to 5bits and not be visibly ruined, means that the bits aren't as important as we all seem to think.

A bit-depth of 5bits is equivalent to taking an 8-bit image and only using 1/8th of the DR, then expanding that out.  Or, shooting a 10-bit image and only exposing using 1/32 of that DR and expanding that out.

Obviously that's not something I'd recommend, and also considering I applied a lot of noise before doing the bit-depth reduction, but the idea that image thickness is related to bit-depth seems to be disproven.

I'm now re-thinking what to test next, but this was an obvious thing and it turned out to be wrong.

But those images were not captured in 5-bit, that is an indicator for final compression, it is NOT an indicator of quality of it as the capture format. 

On 9/9/2020 at 5:42 AM, Emanuel said:

Any idea if properly covers full frame for 16:9 video use? If so, what from focal length? What about if for 2.35:1 (aka 2.39:1) crop?

 

Definitely does not cover Full Frame video. the 11-20 is a much better lens and covers on the long end.

Edit: My mistake, thought this was referring to the 12 - 24 F4. I don't have experience with the 14 - 20 F2. The 11-20 covers Full Frame video from 14-20mm

10 hours ago, ajay said:

I understand about the competition between the two companies. I'm not holding my breath for Resolve to accept the format. What I'm looking for is some kind of workflow and tool to convert ProRes Raw to something else that is lossless or close to it that Resolve can work with. I need a method and some kind of conversion software.

Which camera are you trying to convert? I think if your using the A7s III you can bring and convert the files in Catalyst Browse, unfortunately I can't find online examples of that.  

46 minutes ago, ajay said:

Since more and more cameras are now using the Atomos Ninja V to record ProRes Raw I am curious as to what is the best way to bring the footage into Davinci Resolve since it does not natively edit Pro Res Raw. How painful or painless of a process is it? I really don't want to switch NLE's. I've put way too many man hours into learning Resolve and like what I've got.

Thanks for any input.

I would bet that Resolve get support for it at some point. It's quickly becoming an industry standard. 

10 minutes ago, Danyyyel said:

I am all about getting internal log and 10bit, but to say that Nikon will never be ahead of the video curve is exaggerated when they where the first to give full frame 10bit 2 years ago. Even if it was external, you could get it with a device that's smaller than an actual flash. Now its only two years later than Sony and Canon are giving it to you. Nikon was also the first to give the first ML raw video output, unfortunately for me BMD and Atomos are in a commercial war and Davinci doesn't work with Prores raw. Which is not their fault.  Today's Z6 is still a very very good video camera and hopefully the z6ii put's it again at the top.

I own the Z6, I love it but it has usability problems for video. There is significant delay over the external HDMI, and in the viewfinder itself when shooting in 24p and 30p there is bad delay. 

While these seem like small issues, they are a PITA on actually using it for work.

6 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

Nikon is not in the list of h265 licensees. 

H264 supports 10-bit 4:2:2 

Some beautiful RAW footage. Does anyone know if it is possible to open RAW in Catalyst Browse and export a S-log3 file from that? 

I really hope Nikon does not let me down here. If this camera doesn't come with N-log or 10-bit internal (At 30p, don't even need 60p) I'm probably moving away from Nikon. I'm not staying with a company that clearly will never be ahead of the video curve, plus all my Nikon lenses can be adopted to Sony. 

Same, if it has 4K 60p in 10-bit its really the perfect camera for me. Hope it has a full size HDMI port.

Most digital projectors are 2K (Even digital IMAX is 2 2K projectors next to each other), compression and color win out over 4K every single time unless the audience is told the difference. I can spot it because I look at this stuff constantly. 

11 hours ago, kye said:

I've heard that VFX is a different thing entirely, and that you want RAW and at a high resolution as possible.

The RAW is because you want clean green-screens without having to pull a key and be having to battle with the compression that will blur edges etc.   

The resolution is so that the tracking is as accurate as possible so that when you composite 3D VFX into the clip the VFX parts are as 'locked' to the movement of the captured footage as possible - VFX tracking has to be sub-pixel accurate so that the objects appear like they are in the same space as the footage.

Screening in 2K is probably an advantage as well as it would mean that there is a limit to how clearly the VFX will be seen, so in that sense 2K probably covers up a bunch of sins..   like SD (and then HD) hid details in the hair/makeup department work that higher resolutions exposed.

Your essentially correct on the VFX side for capture, though the 2K for visual effects has less to do with masking flaws than it takes 4 times as long to render a 4K frame than a 2K frame. It's a cost saving measure.

2 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

There are a few manufacturers of encrypted SD cards, so that would take the onus off the camera to do it but you'd have to do some investigation on the speed implications as they are generally made for things like automotive applications rather than the higher demands of writing 4K 10 bit video files etc.

At the risk of pimping the Toshiba FlashAir SD cards yet again......

These cards do provide a solution in that they can automatically offload files in the background to your phone while you are shooting which then means that you have files that are as secure as your phone is from being accessed, providing you are writing them internally, but then you can use an app to encrypt them if you offload them to the micro SD card.

It can also automatically be FTPing them to a cloud server as an additional backup which circumvents the problem of your physical media being seized whilst its in the camera or on your person.

Having secure physical storage is one thing as it means no one can view your footage but if it is taken off you then neither can you.

I think this is really the answer, does the OP think governments who would seize your camera wouldn't just break the memory card if they can't see what you recorded? Backing up to your phone or to a server would be a much safer option in my opinion in these situations. As others have said, secure encoding in camera is a lot of development and hardware costs for a small market. I'd also argue that creating this option would add additional headaches to the manufacturers when they had to troubleshoot issues with this when customers are unable to access their footage/photos. 

Post #100000000 on this.

 ARRI/Canon/Kodak will win the majority. People who know what they're doing can make ANY of these cameras look great and poor artists can make them look bad.

Talent/lighting/lenses/grading make more of a difference than the brand. 

7 hours ago, Hangs4Fun said:

Here's the XLR-K3M running 4 channels into the A7SIII.  This way you inject 24bit/48khz digital signals straight into the media file and have dials and switches of control.  In the A7SIII screen shot you can see the 4 channels levels on the bottom left with a peak marker.  Once the XLR-K3M is plugged in, you can no longer control levels in the camera, it is all controlled on the outside dials of the XLR-K3M.

My typical setup and what I used in this example is a boomed MKH-416 on Channel 1, the XLR mic that came with the XLR-K3M as the on-camera mic (or could be a second boomed mic) as Channel 2, and 2 RODE Wireless Go setups using a splitter that runs one of the lav setups as the left channel (Channel 3) and the other as the right channel (Channel 4).

I verified that I can take the MP4 from the A7SIII with these 4 audio channels into Premiere and see each of the 4 channels and can control each one separately.  For me this is HUGE, because you are basically looking at the FX9 I could not afford (or justify this year) and I needed 4 channels of audio preferably not external, for doing in studio or on location interviews. 

 

 

Thank you very much, this is the type of info that I'm looking for when purchasing a camera for work. 

Any output delay on the HDMI to the Ninja? (My Nikon Z6 and Panasonic S1 has this bad)

If pentax want to continue as a niche product like Leica I think they might be able to pull it off. I think in general now camera sales now are driven by video specs. Because the photography side of things has been "good enough" for awhile.

Hell I occasionally miss my  DSLR, but I was never willing to give pentax a shot because I would not be able to use my nikon glass on it. Mirrorless, I can just adapt my glass so jumping systems is pretty easy. 

7 hours ago, EphraimP said:

My newer Ninja V shipped with the Zilr cable. Unfortunately, because I didn't have a cage/clamp for my X-T4, I bent that sucker in about a week. I have two Cromo branded cables by Lindy that work great and were super cheap. Amazon no longer carries them. I also have a Ugreen cable as a spare. Whatever you buy, buy at least two.

That Micro-HDMI is one of the main reasons I didn't buy a XT-3