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Sony to launch updated FS700R at IBC?

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#1
Andrew Reid

Posted 14 August 2013 - 12:43 PM

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FS700

The Sony FS700 hasn't been out for long by pro equipment standards - around a year. Canon haven't updated the semi-pro 7D DSLR for nearly 5 years!

But Sony are planning an updated FS700R and FS700RH for later in the year, likely to be announced at IBC in Amsterdam this September.

Read the full article here

#2
gene_can_sing

Posted 14 August 2013 - 02:00 PM

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On the surface this update might not seem like much, but you're getting S-Log 2 which sets the DR at an easy useable 13+ stops, probably closer to 14 and clean 20,000 ISO to see in the dark. I did the update and am amazed by S-Log 2, which is decent even on the internal codec.

 

Plus, it opens the door to the Convergent Design 7Q recorder coming next month. 4K at 10 bit 4:2:2 up to 60fps, 2K RAW up to 240fps, HD 10 bit 4:2:2 at 120 fps and HD 10 bit 4:4:4. Then the S-Log 2 will really shine as it needs 10 bit to be really effective. I've notice that with the internal 8 bit, the codec cannot take a lot of saturation without breaking up, otherwise it grades decently.

 

But yeah, twenty 4K cameras coming soon. That's really exciting. Maybe the FS700 with the 7Q will become the B-Cam as I prefer no recorder. Someone needs to just make an FS700 like camera (Internal NDs, high frame rates, great DR, ENG form factor and super lowlight) with a solid internal codec (BMC style). Priced under $10K, and that will change everything.


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#3
HurtinMinorKey

Posted 14 August 2013 - 02:23 PM

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I remember when the fs700 came out it was all the rage, but now it seems like aeons ago. Do people think this camera sold well?



#4
Andrew Reid

Posted 14 August 2013 - 02:33 PM

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I'm not sure the FS100 and FS700 sold well because the ergonomics were more suited to computer keyboards than cameras. C100 and C300 sales probably had them for breakfast.

 

A shame because a lot more tech under the hood on these than on the 'not even 1080/60p for your $15,000' C300.

 

Ergonomics not that wonderful on the C300 anyway. Top Gear bloke used one for a run & gun sequence. Hated it.

 

What Sony need to do is put a decent video chip in their upcoming NEX full frame stills camera and take the market by storm. But they won't.



#5
Marino215

Posted 14 August 2013 - 02:44 PM

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I'm still torn on buying the convergent design recorder. The Sony solution is definitely out, that things ridicules. I'm leaning heavily towards another camera and just keep the fs700 at 1080p and for high speed (when needed, like never) and grab a hyperdeck to maximize the weak 8-bit. s-log. Its a shame Sony could've ruled the market, but they're in for a rude awakening in the next couple years with new cameras coming out.
Canon looks like its headed in the same direction.

#6
tosvus

Posted 14 August 2013 - 03:29 PM

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Not sure why they wouldn't first update the FS100. The FS700 is a lot more expensive.. (so bigger market for FS100, plus it is much older)

 

In any case, I agree with Andrew, they should stop purposely hobbling their Nex cameras. I went away from Nex and with Panasonic since I lost patience with them playing around. Panasonic isn't perfect either, but the GH3 is pretty darn good, with the exception of missing focus-peaking and not outputting 4:2:2 over HDMI.



#7
peederj

Posted 14 August 2013 - 03:46 PM

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The FS700 is the best camera you're willing to cover on this site Andrew. With the Speed booster it's very nice in the way it offers 1080p240 overcrank (albeit 10 second bursts of AVCHD). I would hope for a better IR filter onboard so the color doesn't wash out at high ISO (also critical for overcrank). I imagine we will have to wait for the next generation before the ergonomics and build get anywhere near the C300, which are second only to Alexa in the entire business.

 

The news about 4K is good, I welcome 4K as long as there is a good codec. I would like to repo and stabilize shots freely in post. I am not interested in RAW unless there is no other way to bypass crippling.

 

I don't foresee upgrading from the C100 until NAB or thereafter. This updated FS700 is the only other camera of interest yet announced though. I imagine by the end of 2014 it will be replaced with a 4K XAVC camera with F5 ergonomics/build, hopefully retaining the overcrank capabilities and adding better low-light. By then new Canons should be in the picture too, much to your dismay.



#8
Andrew Reid

Posted 14 August 2013 - 04:17 PM

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"Best" camera? There's no such thing. Best camera for someone who can't afford $8k isn't the FS700!

 

Also the 5D Mark III in raw has better looking 1080p, though I'm keen to find out how the FS700 does in 4K raw.

 

Consider a used FS100 on a budget - when I shot with both, I preferred the 1080/24p on the FS100. Less aliasing and less noise.



#9
peederj

Posted 14 August 2013 - 04:27 PM

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Well I'm happy you're willing to cover at least one camera over $4000USD. Because a lot of the cheaper options end up costing similar once kitted out adequately.

 

The FS700 I've always considered a rental, a poor man's Phantom. But if I shot overcrank instead of low light every week I would have bought one instead of the C100/Ninja 2. Hopefully the R5 rental prices come down with competition from Convergent/AJA/Atomos.



#10
Andrew Reid

Posted 14 August 2013 - 04:34 PM

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Here's an article, 4000 reasons why this guy likes 4K raw on the FS700, but sadly not one of those 4000 reasons alludes to anything concrete, i.e. how good it is compared to non-raw.

 

http://provideocoali...-like-the-fs700

 

I shall have to find out myself!



#11
HurtinMinorKey

Posted 14 August 2013 - 05:38 PM

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Sony, Panny, and Canon have been pretty clearly colluding (even if not overtly) over the past 5 years. This is why we won't see "official" features migrate down the price-product lines with any speed.

 

I would have thought the fs700 market would have almost disappeared. It's got high speed (and maybe 4K someday), but it's image is no where near the raw cameras. It's a great camera for skateboard filmmakers, or other action documentary filming, but I've never seen it look cinematic.



#12
cls105

Posted 14 August 2013 - 09:08 PM

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fs700 w/ sLog 2 + speedbooster w vintage glass

Sounds like a good day to day work camera to me.

I wonder how low fs700 prices will be now that there are new versions coming out.



#13
Olly P

Posted 14 August 2013 - 10:25 PM

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I use the FS700 a lot as a rental camera, and the results can be amazing. Although I find the camera to struggle with strong highlights and its ergonomics are terrible, I enjoy using this camera.

It has a unique place in the market as no other camera can do what it does. I don't really feel that it needs to be compared to other cameras because its use is for specialist purposes.

The image also grades pretty well, and the image is incredibly sharp if you have used a decent sharpening plugin, such as Crumplepop Finisher (which is an amazing little plugin).

But I really do think Panasonic (hello?) should put out a camera that trumps the FS700. They seem to be the only other company to offer 1080/60p to the masses. And no major video camera release since the AF teapot camera.

#14
peederj

Posted 14 August 2013 - 10:37 PM

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The story I heard on Panasonic is that they were working on some revolutionary new codec and the whole effort fell to pieces moments before announcement. That was NAB2012 IIRC. I would figure they are betting everything on 4K right now and will probably have something by NAB2014.

 

I tried all the Crumplepop plugins btw and found no use for any of them. Better things readily available in every category. The free film noir thing may be their hit. I think they are a really cool company with mediocre products, the opposite of say, Coremelt who are a really crummily run company with useful products.



#15
Husah

Posted 16 August 2013 - 05:07 AM

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I don't believe this is different camera. It's just FS700 with 4K firmware/hardware upgrade already done in factory. They just gave it "R" designation so that if someone is buying a new FS700 they would know "R" stocks are already upgraded to 4K. 



#16
Andrew Reid

Posted 16 August 2013 - 11:54 AM

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I don't believe this is different camera. It's just FS700 with 4K firmware/hardware upgrade already done in factory. They just gave it "R" designation so that if someone is buying a new FS700 they would know "R" stocks are already upgraded to 4K. 

 

You could well be right. We'll know soon enough as I might see it before IBC at IFA in Berlin on 4th September.



#17
Filippo Chiesa

Posted 16 August 2013 - 03:10 PM

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IMHO, probably a new FS700 is on the way, but if I know Sony, we will see it at NAB next year.

;)


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