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ProRes vs ProRes - A first look at uncompressed HDMI with the Nikon D5200 vs the Blackmagic Cinema Camera

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D5200 ProRes test

In the early days of DSLR video the codec was probably the weakest part of the camera. With the advent of uncompressed HDMI out - the codec is no longer a weak point but sensor sampling becomes an Achilles Heel.

Can the Nikon D5200 benefit from a hike in image quality from using an external recorder?

earnesync likes this

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Interesting to see effect of  lack of AA filter on the D7100 resolution.

As we saw the D800E being sharper then D800 

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thanks for doing this test my n*****.  

Mondo likes this

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Just did a shoot with the D5200 last night and I was very impressed. Used it along side my GH3. Footage cuts nicely together so far and if I didn't know which camera was which, I wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Very close.

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That language isn't acceptable on this site. Don't care if it was made in jest or whatever. There are just too many who will find it offensive and out of place.

 

Leang you will have a PM shortly.

 

I'm not going to censor you but you have to keep the language inline with acceptability.

Sean Cunningham likes this

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I'm getting very interested on this camera. How do you rate it in comparison over a 5d mkII (as a replacement)?

 

Also, are you planing on a Day light shoot out comparing it against a 5d mk3 or gh3?

 

Thanks Andrew!

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Personally I prefer the 5D Mark III's image, but the D5200 delivers WAY more value. The image is close yet the thing costs $700!

 

I am planning a day light shoot yes. Though to be honest, you can tell a lot more from the low light images because of the way the tonality and lighting is. One thing that I do need to do a day light test for however is dynamic range. A tunnel test. The GH3 and 5D Mark III can both shoot flatter than the D5200 without a load of banding being visible. Generally though, I find all the DSLRs to be pretty similar when it comes to dynamic range. As soon as you grade the image they all have about 9 USABLE stops. Nobody likes the look of an ungraded flat CineStyle image, you're trading other attributes for the ability to place your 9 stops in a different spot, that's all.

 

The dilemma at the moment is that the BMCC is so nice in raw that it leaves all the other cameras looking a bit too digital.

 

I highly recommend experimenting with Film Convert and Film Stocks plugins for Premiere to give the compressed footage more grain and a more authentic film look.

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Just want to say thanks for the great article.You have provided such a great "readout" for the D5200. Thanks.

Andrew Reid likes this

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That language isn't acceptable on this site. Don't care if it was made in jest or whatever. There are just too many who will find it offensive and out of place.

 

Leang you will have a PM shortly.

 

I'm not going to censor you but you have to keep the language inline with acceptability.

 

 

But the Jews in Hollywood are big advocates of Tarantino's writing.  I wonder why.  Seems like hypocritical irony within the entertainment industry, and that's the philosophy of Tarantino's fiction and he gets rewarded...

 

It's the same context.  A mere word is far better than the countless thousands in European stadiums throwing bananas or racial slurs to players.  Never in America.

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I'd expect Jews are an advocate of Tarantino's writing for the same reason the rest of us are. It's bloody good.

 

I really don't get the rest of your point or your excuse for using the word, to be honest.

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But the Jews in Hollywood are big advocates of Tarantino's writing.  I wonder why.  Seems like hypocritical irony within the entertainment industry, and that's the philosophy of Tarantino's fiction and he gets rewarded...

 

Don't be pedantic.  Use in a film or art to serve a point is different.  At the very least, in jest, it's only appropriate between well acquainted friends who can communicate with each other without the need of pretense or editing.  Do you enjoy such a relationship with Andrew?

 

You were just being disrespectful and baiting so that you could play the part of the victim and create or turn this into a political issue with Islamist propaganda overtones.

 

 

It's the same context.  A mere word is far better than the countless thousands in European stadiums throwing bananas or racial slurs to players.  Never in America.

 

Dude, you choose to live and work in a country that criminally indicts individuals residing in other countries for TWEETS they see as anti-Islamic.  GTFO with your very ironic hypocrisy.  

zephyrnoid and Andrew Reid like this

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The problem I have with Leang's use of the offensive word is that he put it on print appended to one of my own articles.

 

I don't want to control like a hawk what goes in the forum. But this takes the biscuit it really does. If a print newspaper or magazine used such offensive words, with such vague context and a completely unclear meaning as to whether it was meant as an insult, slang, a joke or outright racism they'd offend thousands and rightly be taken to task for it.

 

I don't want that to happen here.

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I'd expect Jews are an advocate of Tarantino's writing for the same reason the rest of us are. It's bloody good.

 

I really don't get the rest of your point or your excuse for using the word, to be honest.

 

Exactly, so whenever you hear the N word in Tarantino's films and you're enjoying the moment remember me or press mute from your remote control and stand by your belief!  

 

There is no excuse.  The point is that we're exaggerating the context and I have to remind people of some weird conservative hypocrisy at a film forum!  

 

Oh yeah btw did I mention thanks for the article?  I think I did.

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So it is a creative thing?

 

Well it didn't work. Please stick to the normal language from now on, cheers!

Axel and Leang like this

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Don't be pedantic.  Use in a film or art to serve a point is different.  At the very least, in jest, it's only appropriate between well acquainted friends who can communicate with each other without the need of pretense or editing.  Do you enjoy such a relationship with Andrew?

 

You were just being disrespectful and baiting so that you could play the part of the victim and create or turn this into a political issue with Islamist propaganda overtones.

 

 

 

Dude, you choose to live and work in a country that criminally indicts individuals residing in other countries for TWEETS they see as anti-Islamic.  GTFO with your very ironic hypocrisy.  

 

Oh no not you again.  I'll see my reply as a comic relief for general viewers since I strongly believe those that follow this site are not soft.  lol.  Therefore we have a nice double header at the movies!  1.  We've got a nice article, 2.  We've got a VFX artist from Texas theorizing on Turkey from general CNN.  I think the next time I go to Amsterdam I'm gonna roll a nice phat one and think about the every so boring conservative state of Texas.  

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Andrew, you mentioned that you'd get around to reviewing GH3 qualities vis-a-vis other DSLR's and also on it's own merit.  I'm wondering if you're still planning that review?  I'm sure a lot of people are looking forward to it.  I know I am.  It will be very interesting to hear your opinion, whenever you get a chance.  Thanks

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Yes sure. Only thing holding back the review is the sample footage. I want it to do the camera justice and that takes time to get right. I don't just want to sling up some test shots as I have done before with the GH3. That is taking some time to put together with the current shooting schedule.

 

BTW I'm also interested to hear from anyone in Berlin with a C100 or C300. Get in touch and come on some shoots. So few people actually own one, it is all rental stuff!

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What's the cheapest/easiest way to monitor audio via the mini hdmi output on the d5200? I assume a simple crossover cable/adapter isn't an option given its digital coming out via the mini HDMI whilst you need to monitor in analogue via headphones.

Am I missing something?

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Regarding the query as to whether Canon will provide 4:2:2 out, it's already possible to get 4:2:2 out of a Canon, Magic Lanterns Silent Pic function, ML writes the 4:2:2 to the card, it's just not possible to sustain the frame rate and the resolution varies between cameras.

 

I don't think even the 5D MKIII is full 1920x1080. Encoder feed is 1720x974 (550D) and 1904x1072 (5D3). 600D, sizes are 1728x972 (crop) and 1680x945 (non-crop).

 

But 4:2:2 out in April shouldn't be a big deal, think the pre release 5D MKIII's had 4:2:2 hdmi out enabled by accident and switched off at release?

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Personally I prefer the 5D Mark III's image, but the D5200 delivers WAY more value. The image is close yet the thing costs $700!

 

I am planning a day light shoot yes. Though to be honest, you can tell a lot more from the low light images because of the way the tonality and lighting is. One thing that I do need to do a day light test for however is dynamic range. A tunnel test. The GH3 and 5D Mark III can both shoot flatter than the D5200 without a load of banding being visible. Generally though, I find all the DSLRs to be pretty similar when it comes to dynamic range. As soon as you grade the image they all have about 9 USABLE stops. Nobody likes the look of an ungraded flat CineStyle image, you're trading other attributes for the ability to place your 9 stops in a different spot, that's all.

 

The dilemma at the moment is that the BMCC is so nice in raw that it leaves all the other cameras looking a bit too digital.

 

I highly recommend experimenting with Film Convert and Film Stocks plugins for Premiere to give the compressed footage more grain and a more authentic film look.

Thanks for your answer.

 

I actually been using film convert on my 5d mk2. Awesome results!

 

The point of my dilemma its that I'm really tired of the moire/aliasing issues on my 5D and I'm searching for a replacement (one that i can afford) and not to be losing IQ on the process. 

 

Thanks.

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But 4:2:2 out in April shouldn't be a big deal, think the pre release 5D MKIII's had 4:2:2 hdmi out enabled by accident and switched off at release?

 

If they did switch it off before release I hope they also lowered the price.

BydrodoFieddy likes this

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Excellent and level headed review. Thanks
"We’re getting closer – but no cigar!"

Indeed!

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Oh no not you again.  I'll see my reply as a comic relief for general viewers since I strongly believe those that follow this site are not soft.  lol.  Therefore we have a nice double header at the movies!  1.  We've got a nice article, 2.  We've got a VFX artist from Texas theorizing on Turkey from general CNN.  I think the next time I go to Amsterdam I'm gonna roll a nice phat one and think about the every so boring conservative state of Texas.  

 

ROFL, wow, you're so baller.  

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The thing that frustrates me about Nikon is that they really have no reason to hold back when it comes to competing in the Cinema DLSR market.  Why are they stepping in so timidly when they can really just go all out with at least one of their cameras and tweak it for Cinema use.  Put in a robust codec, LOG Profile... You know just get serious and kick Canon in the teeth.  Even if they didn't go all out and do a 4K camera, why not a 2.5k D800 or D7100? 

 

The D5200 comes so close to giving people what they want in an affordable Hybrid camera and yet such basic flaws in the camera that don't seem to need to be there.  How much more would it cost them to ask Pros what they should deliver in Cinema Nikon?  As long as they price their cameras under Canon they'd likely be successful as heck.  Still the D5200 is a heck of a bargain.  I can't wait to see what the deal is with the D7100.

Sean Cunningham and nahua like this

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As long as they price their cameras under Canon they'd likely be successful as heck....

 

You'd almost think they had some kind of back room deal going so that none of them released any serious, deciding threat to each other or their own over-bloated pro lines.  Then along comes some little company (by comparison) with a camera called the BMCC who didn't get that memo and they're left looking rather lazy and stupid to all but serious stills photographers.

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