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Sony F35 reaches $12,000 on eBay from $250,000 in 2008

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#1
Andrew Reid

Posted 29 January 2013 - 09:54 PM

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Sony F35

A Hollywood workhorse to this day, the Sony F35 (also rebadged as Panavision Genesis) is a Super 35mm PL mount digital cinema camera and also an extraordinarily good deal on the used market in 2013.

It has 14 stops of dynamic range and a global shutter. It has taken CMOS sensor in the F65 a full five years to surpass the CCD sensor in the F35 / Genesis, which was used to shoot Tim Burton's Alice In Wonderland, Superman Returns and Apocalypto.


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#2
Kasper Mols

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:05 PM

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Wow, just wow.



#3
Mondo

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:05 PM

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That's absurd, but awesome.



#4
ScreensPro

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:19 PM

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It's interesting and i think there will be some amazing bargains to be had on this 1st generation cinema gear. F35, RED One... maybe even Alexa in a few years. F3, FS100, AF100, Scarlet are following suit too.... I saw an F3 with 3 PL Lenses go for less than £4k!

 

I'd guess that the depreciation will slow down with the next generation though.... How much better can a camera get than the F55? More than 14 stops, not many shots need it.... More than 4K.... I'm not even convinced 4K will take off for anything more than cinema films and maybe sports.... ISO higher than 64,000 or whatever crazy spec the F55 has? Faster than 120fps? Higher than 16 bits?

 

The audio world showed that increases in digital technology tailed off and the price did too. There was nowhere left to go with the high end. I think we are reaching that point with video now. Which is great news for us!



#5
jgharding

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:22 PM

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I agree entirely. 

 

I was only yesterday talking to someone from a production company who was thinking of buying a 1DC for Alexa style shoots. 

 

I took them to eBay to see the F3, F35, Red One. I think I changed their mind...


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#6
Cfreak

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:23 PM

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Awesome price, but beware if you need a part or accessory for then you'd better have the big bucks! 

No chance to put your EF or Nikon glass on that either!



#7
FilmMan

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:40 PM

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Thought about a used f35. 

1.  Breaks then what?  cost to fix?  parts?

2.  Recorder needed.

3.  Size.

4.  Battery

 

It is an awesome camera.  Recent movie, "Real Steel" was shot with it. 


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#8
GrooveMechanic

Posted 29 January 2013 - 10:47 PM

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Wow, there are 2 for sale and Clairemont Camera is literaly a 15 min walk from my house. I may go and give one a look.



#9
Andrew Reid

Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:00 PM

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Wow, there are 2 for sale and Clairemont Camera is literaly a 15 min walk from my house. I may go and give one a look.

 

Tell them I sent you :)



#10
Andrew Reid

Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:02 PM

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Thought about a used f35. 

1.  Breaks then what?  cost to fix?  parts?

2.  Recorder needed.

3.  Size.

4.  Battery

 

It is an awesome camera.  Recent movie, "Real Steel" was shot with it. 

 

1. You're f***ed

2. $1000 on top of $12k is not much, most will already have one. Atomos Samurai should go well (since you'll also need the monitor)

3. If it is portability you want then go for a DSLR no question

4. Battery - need to research that



#11
Glenn Thomas

Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:09 PM

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I remember Stargate Universe was shot on a Genesis, and that was a nice looking show. You'd see the occasional vertical flare from the CCD sensor, but it still looked good.

Anyway, I agree with ScreensPro above, that hopefully all this technology will tail off like what has happened with audio. In the audio world, the digital gear now is about as good as it will get. For anybody wanting to spend big money on gear for an improvement in sound quality, the only real options are expensive outboard gear. Old compressors, preamps and valve gear. Technology that's been around for 50 years or more. Even analog synthesizers have made a come back, and with cv gate sockets too that previously died off back in the early 80s.

So for cameras, once they peak, I imagine the only real investment to be made will be in lenses. Cameras that can shoot RAW may become more popular, but in the same way as people have been able to record audio at 24/32 bit 192khz for many years now, most will probably not bother with it.
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#12
ScreensPro

Posted 29 January 2013 - 11:47 PM

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This is where I tip my hat to Jim Jannard......

 

Love or hate RED (i'm somewhere in between).... You just know that Jim Jannard wants to produce the pinnacle of digital cameras as soon as possible, without too much concern about making a huge profit or holding back tech for the next release..... He's building his dream camera. The dragon may well be the pinnacle, especially if it is CCD or global shutter. Nowhere left to go other than ergonomics, NDs, battery time etc (non image aspects of the camera).

 

Once we hit that, and we might be just a few months away.... Then it is gonna be good times all round.



#13
Leang

Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:57 AM

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 In the audio world, the digital gear now is about as good as it will get. For anybody wanting to spend big money on gear for an improvement in sound quality, the only real options are expensive outboard gear. Old compressors, preamps and valve gear. Technology that's been around for 50 years or more. Even analog synthesizers have made a come back, and with cv gate sockets too that previously died off back in the early 80s.

So for cameras, once they peak, I imagine the only real investment to be made will be in lenses. Cameras that can shoot RAW may become more popular, but in the same way as people have been able to record audio at 24/32 bit 192khz for many years now, most will probably not bother with it.

 

I agree about the lenses.  Nikon FX format will eventually adopt to 4K video.  and in about 2-3 years we'll start seeing 4K on APS-C consumer, and as others mention determine "true 4K" marketing.  Nikon just announced AF-S NIKKOR 800mm f/5.6E & free teleconverter for 1000mm f/7.1 -  serious glass for later 4K FX!   B)  



#14
GravitateMediaGroup

Posted 30 January 2013 - 01:21 AM

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battery and charger not included = $2500

so 12,000 just jumped to  14,500



#15
hmcindie

Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:47 AM

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"A CCD sensor generally has better colour reproduction and sharpness than CMOS"

 

What? There is no difference in colour reproduction or sharpness between a CCD and CMOS. There are two main variables. Light streaks with CCD and rolling shutter with CMOS. Everything else depends on the actual engineering of the CCD/CMOS, not the type. And even then you can make a global shutter CMOS if you make the space for the electronics needed.



#16
jgharding

Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:05 AM

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I really miss vertical light streaks from CCD!

 

Actually I love em in most situations. At least compared to jello, they're actually aesthetically pleasing a lot of the time!


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#17
ScreensPro

Posted 30 January 2013 - 12:48 PM

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Not sure it has 14 stops either.... Seem to remember reading more like 12 stops... but alot of misinformation out there.

 

Certainly has a great image though.



#18
QuickHitRecord

Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:46 PM

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This would not be practical for my purposes, but the idea that this level of depreciation can happen in such a short amount of time suggests that everybody here will have a shot at an Alexa by 2022.



#19
Alex Mand

Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:01 PM

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Bought my BT R1MX for less than 10k complete package with 40hrs. 4.5K, 120fps 2k, Red color 3 now, great sharpness, good latitude... Ok It will not upgrade the sensor in the future, but neither the F3 or FS700... Just shot an ad with it... Hard to believe I can afford such equipment for that money...


Go shoot!

#20
Will Turner

Posted 06 February 2013 - 02:24 PM

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Depreciation is only happening more and more quickly though, as technology progresses at an exponential rate. I've been excited for a year or two now at the prospect of finding an alexa on ebay in 10-20 years for 50 quid. But by that time it isn't exciting, because something new and amazing has been invented. 

 

I had a conversation with my old man asking him why he isn't buying up all the old tech he dreamed of as a kid now it costs pittance. He doesn't because now we have plasma TV's with HD broadcasts, iphones, DSLRs, etc. 

 

An F35 would be really great right now, but I wonder how long until it becomes genuinely obsolete? 






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