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APS-C and Super 35mm just went full frame - Metabones Speed Booster

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Posted · Report post

The idea is fantastic! I wonder if it is possible to make x1.33 anamorphic adapter this way too. SLR Magic, how are you?

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Imagine a version of this with only the speed booster : MFT camera > speed booster > MFT lens.

Those would be killer!

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Posted · Report post

I dont think that is right.

A FF lens 50mm 1.8 will be (with the adaptor) 50mm f/1.2   not 35mm ... am i wrong ?

You cant mount apcs size lens (50mm f/1.8).

 

Buy a Speed Booster + 50mm 1.8 or buy a 35mm f/1.2 without speed booster. They will give the same image characteristics (an image equivalent to 50mm f/1.8 on a fullframe-sensor)

 

Speed-Booster-comparison.png

 

An easy way to comprehend what this converter does is just imagining the opposite of an extender/teleconverter.

A teleconverter makes your focal lenght longer, you loose light, depth of field and sharpness. The Speed Booster makes your focal length shorter, you win light, dof and sharpness (in theory..).

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This adapter doesn't actually make the lens wider. It just keeps the same FOV as you would see on a Full Frame body. So a 50mm+Speed Booster on a Super 35mm sensor will give you around the same FOV as a 50mm on a FF body. Pretty neat. It also means you won't have to upgrade to a FF Body to achieve that FF shallow depth of field. Basically, you pay $600 to turn your APS-C camera into a FF body. It's just too bad it will only work on mirrorless cameras.  

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Imagine a version of this with only the speed booster : MFT camera > speed booster > MFT lens.

Those would be killer!

 

That's not how it works. It provides more light to the sensor by virtue of taking the larger image circle and compressing it (intensifying) to the smaller sensor size. You can only compress lenses that provide a larger image circle. So FF to APS-C (or smaller), or APS-C to mFT (or smaller).

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I can't wait to adapt my Nikkor 50mm f/1.2 AI-S onto my GH3 with the speed booster. 

 

ALSO, question for you guiz. With this adapter some older MF zooms with the (extra stop of light?) plus wider focal length are going to become very appealing. What's going to be the best? zoom range + f/stop wise.

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This adapter doesn't actually make the lens wider. It just keeps the same FOV as you would see on a Full Frame body. So a 50mm+Speed Booster on a Super 35mm sensor will give you around the same FOV as a 50mm on a FF body.

 

Which means it makes your lens wider... just like an extender makes your lens longer.

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Posted · Report post


Which means it makes your lens wider... just like an extender makes your lens longer.

 

I think folks are just arguing over language. It makes the field of vision at the sensor wider, yes. The field of vision at the lens, and the focal length, remain unchanged. An extender (as a wide angle adapter) does it differently, as it works with the light entering the lens, not exiting.

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I remember we were chatting a long while back about these, I remember at the time there was some kind of patent -- maybe Eastman Kodak -- that meant no-one could make them, so I'm glad this has been worked around. Maybe the Isco/Schnieder patent can too...

 

Although many find it hard to believe  all the research I've done shows there's no significant downsides to this technology. It's actually used INSIDE some premium M4/3 lenses at the moment, with established  F2.8 designs incorporating an optical reducer in order to give a nice field of view for the crop sensor and bump up the F-stop.

 

I'dve though the only downside will be that with some lenses the corners will remain the same, while only the centre will be sharper. Not much of a downside.

 

It's a bit like scaling down footage shot on a soft camera, suddenly it's much sharper than before...

richg101 likes this

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this is the best bit of news i have seen in a long while.  What a simple yet superbly innovative idea.  At first I expected it to cut down light transmission as you get with 1.4x and 2x extenders.  and affect the sharpness loads.  But from the tests it looks only marginally softer.  the best part of this is that we'll get extra speed, while the dof remains the same.  is this right?  

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Although many find it hard to believe  all the research I've done shows there's no significant downsides to this technology. It's actually used INSIDE some premium M4/3 lenses at the moment, with established  F2.8 designs incorporating an optical reducer in order to give a nice field of view for the crop sensor and bump up the F-stop.

 

 

hence all the unbelievable lens figures in m4/3 mount.  Wides with nuts fast apertures.  Now it makes sense how they actually do this.

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I think folks are just arguing over language. It makes the field of vision at the sensor wider, yes. The field of vision at the lens, and the focal length, remain unchanged. An extender (as a wide angle adapter) does it differently, as it works with the light entering the lens, not exiting.

 

Yes, it's a language thing... of course it doesn't physically change the lens, but you get exactly the same image you would get with a wider lens.

 

By extender I mean a teleconverter (which also works with the light exiting), which works the same but the other way around.
Canon-Extender-Tele-Converter-1.4x-MK-II

 

@Richg101: Yes indeed. Extra speed, better quality in theory (downscaling the lens faults) and same dof as on fullframe. Just imagine the exact opposite effects of a 1.4x extender.

itimjim likes this

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Posted · Report post

Which means it makes your lens wider... just like an extender makes your lens longer.

 

Too bad Canon doesn't have a decent Mirrorless body out yet. 

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That's not how it works. It provides more light to the sensor by virtue of taking the larger image circle and compressing it (intensifying) to the smaller sensor size. You can only compress lenses that provide a larger image circle. So FF to APS-C (or smaller), or APS-C to mFT (or smaller).

 

I was actually thinking of using my old Lomo oct-18 (that would cover 35mm anyway if I'm not mistaking) with this to get a bit more light/larger FOV...

I understand that "native" m43 lenses would not benefit from this adapter.

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Metabones seem to be making Leica R adapters, so let's assume they'll produce a Leica R to m43 speedbooster.

Would that work to get an adapted m43 lens to m43 speedbooster?

 

m43 camera > Speedbooster Leica R to m43 > m43 to Leica R adapter (passive) > whatever format to m43

 

A bit complicated, I know ...

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m43 camera > Speedbooster Leica R to m43 > m43 to Leica R adapter (passive) > whatever format to m43

 

I don't see the point or logic there.. if you want to adapt other lenses, the EOS adapter would be the best option.

 

On the EOS mount you can use Canon EF (of course), Nikon F, M42 and Leica R with adapters.

 

You can't use 'whatever format' because the register distance will have to be as long as Canon EF mount at least. Leica M, Canon FD etc is no option.

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Does this mean I can use wider taking lenses for anamorphic? ... or the opposite?

 

Opposite, like on a full frame sensor you will need a longer focal length to avoid vignetting with the anamorphic.

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am i just not understanding it? is it not just something like a fixed zoom lens? or lets say similar to a 35-50 f2.8 to 4 zoom but just to screw on? in the end the physical sensor size doesn´t change.

 

does it really create a ff image on a crop sensor or doesn´t it just work as a wide angle converter? or is the same? if it is i´d like a medium format to f-mount speed booster please! that would be really revolutionary. and would save me 30.000 for a H4D! there must be a catch why nobody has done that so far. there is hasselblad to nikkor adaptor, but withoutbthe glass.

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Before we all get too excited, I think there are technical reasons why optical reducers aren't commonplace.

 

They are used on astronomical telescopes, but that's a different situation from using them on video or stills cameras.

 

If I recall correctly from the dim distant days when I was into amateur astronomy, optical reducers can suffer from vignetting and also limit the range of distances at which the setup can be focussed. With an astronomical telescope that's no problem as you are almost always focusing near infinity - but with a camera for terrestrial use not being able to focus closer than (say) 100 feet would be a big limitation!

 

So I think it remains to be seen what the practical issues are - it may be that these things will only be workable with certain camera/lens combinations.

 

If it was a panacea for getting the FF look on small sensor cameras I'm sure the big manufacturers would have been on to it by now...

 

Regarding focus, the focus point on James Miller's video with the bottles is what... half a metre? It would appear they got around any focus issues here.

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It is. This thing saves a shitload of money you'd have to spend on glass and this is the most amazing wide angle solution for MFT...

 

Cheap 50mm f/1.8 = 35mm f/1.2
Cheap 24mm f/2.8 = 17mm f/2
Sigma 20mm f/1.8 = 14mm f/1.2 (drool)

 

Actually the adapter for micro four thirds would have different glass in it to suit the sensor size, 0.5x instead of 0.71x so your Sigma 20mm F1.8 would be a 10mm (at F1.0??!) and the same 20mm equivalent wide angle on full frame on the 2x crop sensor of the GH3.

 

The speed gain for the 2x crop sensor will be even greater than for the 1.5x crop Sony E-mount sensors.

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Posted · Report post

Imagine a version of this with only the speed booster : MFT camera > speed booster > MFT lens.

Those would be killer!

 

You can't have the speed boost on its own. The speed boost is a result of the optics here, of reducing the image circle down to fit the smaller sensor.

 

Imagine ants under a magnifying glass. The smaller the circle of light projected by the glass the hotter and brighter it is.

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Now... How does a NEX6 _ speed booster + canon 24-70mm f2.8 L zoom sound? BOOM!

Phase AF, low pixel rating of 16mp while still getting full frame field of view, and a 24-70mm f1.8 equivalent!

(assuming metabones implement AF on this like they say they will on the current nex-ef via firmware

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The Speed Booster makes your focal length shorter, you win light, dof and sharpness (in theory..).


It's more like if it makes your sensor bigger.

When you use a 50mm on an APS-C sized sensor, you get roughly the equivalent of an 80mm, with this adapter you'd keep it as 50mm, no more math.

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Actually the adapter for micro four thirds would have different glass in it to suit the sensor size, 0.5x instead of 0.71x so your Sigma 20mm F1.8 would be a 10mm (at F1.0??!) and the same 20mm equivalent wide angle on full frame on the 2x crop sensor of the GH3.

 

The speed gain for the 2x crop sensor will be even greater than for the 1.5x crop Sony E-mount sensors.

 

Did Metabones state this somewhere? A 0,5x Speed Booster sounds great... but I suppose it would be harder to manufacture and it would be bigger/more expensive. If they could pull it off it would be awesome. every cheap fullframe f/2.8 wideangle turning into f/1.4... :wub:

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It's more like if it makes your sensor bigger.

When you use a 50mm on an APS-C sized sensor, you get roughly the equivalent of an 80mm, with this adapter you'd keep it as 50mm, no more math.


Exactly, it just squeezes a Full-Frame sensor FOV onto the smaller crop sensor. Technology is amazing. 

Canon needs to start making some solid EOS-M bodies now. 

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